E404 A Spider Problem and a Grumpy Toad

TOPICS: THE OLD FAITHFUL INN, VICTORIA CILLIERS PT. 2

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Have you seen our skeleton legs? It’s episode 404 and we’re recapping our Halloweens as homeowners - we swear we give out handfuls of candy not just one piece at a time! This week Em takes us to Yellowstone and the tale of the hauntings of the Old Faithful Inn. Then Christine brings us the second part in her series on the wild story of Victoria Cilliers. And for all that is spooky, please vote this Tuesday (info below)… and that’s why we drink!

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Transcript

[intro music]

Em: [singing] ♪ Ahh, welcome to And That’s Why We Drink ♪ [creating echo effect] Drink, drink, drink. 

Christine: [whispering the echo effect] Drink, drink, drink, drink, drink. 

Em: [singing] ♪ Welcome to– ♪♪  Yeah, keep, keep go– ♪ And That– Welcome to And That’s Why We– ♪♪  

Christine: [whispering echoes] Drink, drink, drink, drink, drink. 

Em: [chanting] Drink! Drink! 

Christine: [singing, holds high note] ♪ Drink ♪ 

Em: [chanting] Drink! Drink! [speaking] And then like a rea– Like a [improv vocal riff] ♪ Dri-i-i-ink! ♪♪  Something like that. 

Christine: [singing] [improv vocal riff with twang] ♪ Y-ea-ea-eah ♪♪  Oh, yeah! 

Em: Also this is episode 404, which makes me think that there is a constant error issue on my notes. Um– 

Christine: [laughs] Maybe we just delete it and say, “Sorry, there was a 404 error. We don’t have time for this today.” 

Em: [laughs] That, that would have been the most hysterical way to skip a week that– Wouldn’t it? 

Christine: Man, I wish we had thought of that sooner, okay. Well, that stinks. 

Em: [sighs] Oh, Christine, how are you? I haven’t seen you in like five minutes it feels like. 

Christine: I know, and it’s so hard on my heart. 

Em: Aw. 

Christine: Um, it’s wonderful to see you. I, uh, I’m actually drinking tea today, which is a, a rare thing for me, but the last couple days, I’ve been in a tea mood. Um– 

Em: Is it tea or is it like THC in your tea? 

Christine: I wish. No, I was not quite so bold, uh, ’cause it’s only– Well, o– Because we have a Halloween livestream tonight that I have to prepare my mind and body and soul for, so it’s just tea. 

Em: I would think that’s how you’re gonna prepare for it. You’re just getting all warmed up, getting all fuzzy from the inside, you know? 

Christine: Yeah, but then by then I’m like ready to go to bed, and it’s like– 

Em: Oh. [laughs] 

Christine: –I gotta save up my energy, you know. But, look at my mu– my mug. “Mothman believes in you” is my mug. I didn’t even pick it on purpose. Just every mug in my cabinet has something tangentially to do with our show, so, um– 

Em: That’s beautiful. 

Christine: It’s a Mothman. But, um, so I’m drinking some green tea coconut– with coconut in it. 

Em: Oh? Stunning. 

Christine: Um, and I drink because I finally, just now before we recorded, finally got my Halloween decorations set up. 

Em: Oh! It is the 30th. [laughs] 

Christine: Halloween is in 12 hours, yeah. [laughs] But honestly, I’m so happy they’re there. ’Cause like with trick-or-treaters tomorrow, I’m like, I was gonna be really sad if I didn't finish getting it all set up. So now I’m– Now I’m set. Um, it took me– 

Em: I gotta say– 

Christine: –a while this year, but I’m here. 

Em: Allison really nailed the Halloween decorations this time because we’ve been traveling so much that I– 

Christine: Can you send me pictures later? 

Em: Mm-hmm. Yeah, I’ll send– 

Christine: How you did it with your new house? 

Em: I’ll send you pictures. Well, so the inside– It’s as decorated as it can be, but we– Technically, other than our bedroom, our house is just one room. So there’s only like– There used to be some like, uh, decorations over there, decorations over here. And now we’ve– 

Christine: [laughs] Like different like stations. 

Em: Stations. And now we’ve got like a lot of little things that– in like just really four walls. So. 

Christine: But I like that ’cause then it’s almost more like condensed. Like oh, the whole vibe is now spooky. 

Em: But– I agree with you, but, but we don’t have a lot of furniture to sit a lot of stuff on, so it’s really– It feels more like we just kinda put– 

Christine: [laughs] Just like sitting on the floor. 

Em: Yeah, you know. Like– [laughs] 

Christine: Listen, that’s okay. You literally just moved in. Um, I’m shocked that you even had the time – or Allison did – to ha– to get decorations out of boxes, so. 

Em: Well, she– No, she did it. Uh, the outside looks great. She really nailed the outside. 

Christine: I’m very impressed. 

Em: The inside still looks– 

Christine: Yeah, send me pictures. Definitely don’t, like you said, don’t send pictures maybe to the social media. 

Em: Mm-mmm. Nah, people can imagine for them– 

Christine: But, uh, I’ll look at it happily. 

Em: They can imagine. 

Christine: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 

Em: Uh, and also because we live in Burbank, uh, which I have said before is a very year-round Halloween heavy town– 

Christine: Yes? 

Em: Um, because this is where a lot of the movie people like do their prop and, and set shopping, and so there’s a lot of year-round Halloween stores. Um, but in– not in our neighborhood, like our specific suburb of Burbank, but in the neighborhood of Burbank, everyone takes Halloween really seriously when it comes to decorating outside. 

Christine: Mm. 

Em: And so, um, it was so funny. I was– Allison and I, every year, we at least have one night each October where we try to go as to as many big houses as possible– 

Christine: Right. 

Em: –that like they have to register and everything to like be on this like specific map of “places you should go see.” And they’re like these incredible– 

Christine: So do you go in them or just look at them? 

Em: Sometimes. They– Like people literally turn their houses into like jump scare attractions and stuff. 

Christine: So kind of like that Modern Family episode? 

Em: Yeah, yeah. 

Christine: Okay. 

Em: It– And people have like the 12 foot skeletons, and– 

Christine: Mm. 

Em: – like they build these really elaborate sets, and like they even go– It pours over onto like the sidewalk, and in the trees there’s stuff, and– It’s very big. 

Christine: There was one house like that this year. The house had been for sale last year, and it’s this gorgeous house. Um, and I would always drive past and be like, “Oh, I wonder who’s gonna buy it?” Well, somebody awesome– 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: –because last week I drove past and went, “Holy smokes!” People were pulling their cars over– 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: – just to like take pictures. I mean it– And it was the middle of the day. I was like, “Oh, on Halloween, we have to walk past this house.” it is– I was just– And they have like all– It’s this really really beautiful old like Victorian house, and they have all these different balconies. And like everyone has a different like– 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: –you know, creature coming and climbing the wall. It’s just– 

Em: It’s crazy. 

Christine: I– It’s beautiful. And I was like, “oh, well I’m glad my new neighbor is apparently, uh, on the right track. I like it.” 

Em: Yeah, I– We moved to the right neighborhood, for sure– 

Christine: Yes. Yes. 

Em: – ’cause we have that going on. And last year too, um, our friend, Delanie, who you know– 

Christine: Mm-hmm. 

Em: She has a, um, her own lovely podcast called Self-Helpless. Please go check it out. Um, but Allison and I went to her house, and she hosted like a little Halloween party where the whole point was all of her friends get together so they could just– we could just walk down the neighborhood and just see all the houses. 

Christine: [groans] Oh! 

Em: But it, it was like walking through, I imagine, downtown Salem on Halloween night. Like it was like– 

Christine: Ohh. 

Em: You– We couldn’t even be with our own party. We lost each other at some point and like– 

Christine: [laughs] Oh my God, you had to get like the matching t-shirts like you do at Disney with your family. 

Em: [laughs] I mean, there were, there were houses that literally like had pyrotechnic teams come in and like set like their house like– Like there was one that like literally the roof would like catch on fire every 30 seconds like to like– as part of the bit. 

Christine: Holy shit! 

Em: Like they don’t fuck around in Burbank. And I’ll even– Like on TikTok, I’ve been like finding like my neighbor’s houses like on TikTok– 

Christine: Oh my god, you’re like, “Wait a minute.” [laughs] 

Em: –because they’re like st– going viral. Yeah. So anyway, that’s been very fun, but as I say our, our outside looks great, and Allison nailed it. She nailed it for like a, a normal– 

Christine: For a normy. 

Em: –n– [laughs] for a normal neighborhood. Like we don’t have like a display quite like that yet, but that’s the goal. 

Christine: No, mine’s very simple this year too. It’s– It like– And I– Mine’s kind– I keep trying to, I keep trying to not triangulate myself. It’s so hard ’cause I’m like trying to describe the like layout, and I’m like, “Let’s not do that.” 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: Um, but I will say today I put up these like– this giant like multi-story spiderweb, and by that I mean I just throw it out the window– 

Em: Beautiful. [laughs] 

Christine: –and then like hook it on the fence. It actually worked really great. Um, but I was around the corner like putting up some bats on the wall, and this woman walked past and said, “You might want to call Orkin–“ which is like our local, um, exterminator– 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: –“’cause you’ve got a spider problem on the property.” And I went, “Excuse me?” 

Em: Are you serious? 

Christine: Well, it’s ’cause I just put up all those giant spiders, and she walked around the corner, and she was making a joke. 

Em: Oh. [laughs] 

Christine: And I was like, “I’m so stupid.” I went– 

Em: I also was that stupid. 

Christine: –“Oh my god, seriously?” And I mean, and I’m not kidding you– And she had passed me like five minutes earlier when I was doing the spiders and said like, “Ooh! Scary,” and walked away, came back, said, “You might want to call Orkin.” And I said, “What? Why?” She’s like, “Because of your spider problem,” and I went, “A spider problem?” I mean, I’m like so out of my mind, um– 

Em: In hindsight, that’s a beautiful– She sounds like someone you should run into again and try to make friends with. 

Christine: I was gonna say she really like nailed it, and I just missed the– I just whiffed it. But, um, o– I will add also one of the Halloween related reasons I drink as well is because last year– Part of the reason I’m kinda delayed is that a bunch of our stuff was stolen last year. 

Em: Mm. 

Christine: And someone stole my skeleton. And I’ve had him for years, and I loved him, and I was– He was so important to me, and some teenager just fucking took him. Six foot skeleton – just took him right off the porch, walked away. 

Em: That’s awful. 

Christine: Yeah, so my new one comes today, but it was like I had to get one last minute ’cause I’d forgotten he disappeared. And I was hoping someone would return him, but alas. 

Em: Alas. 

Christine: He’s gone. 

Em: That’s awful. 

Christine: He's coming, he’s coming today. I’ll put him up by tomorrow, and I’m gonna put– I’ve decided I’m gonna put a motion activated thing– 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: –so that when anyone tries to come near him, and– It’ll just scream at you. 

Em: [spooked] Ooh! 

Christine: So that they don’t, don’t steal it ag– I’ll say, “I see you, teenagers. You’re on camera.” That’s what it’ll say. 

Em: That’ll do it. 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: And they’re not on camera, but they don’t need to know that. 

Em: No, and at ISS, at my old prop house, uh, the craziest part is that they claimed that there were security cameras everywhere, so like they– Because they were like, “Oh, we don’t want you to steal props from a TV show,” which is fair. 

Christine: Right, right, right, right, right. 

Em: But half the fucking security cameras were props. They weren’t even fucking real security– 

Christine: Right, right. It’s like how do you even know if any of this is real? [laughs] 

Em: So they just expected people to just live in fear because I would see security cameras all over the place. And then it– I was like, “I don’t even know if that’s actually real or if they just took one from storage and just kinda stuck it on there.” Or a lot of times, they would literally just spray paint the top of like a Starbucks lid, like the round ones, and then just like glue it to the ceiling. 

Christine: [laughs] What? 

Em: And I’d be like, “Is that a–?” It– ’Cause it kind of from far away looks like– 

Christine: “Is that my Frappuccino? What’s happening?” [laughs] 

Em: [laughs] There were so many times where I was like, “I can’t– Like this place is like so trashy but also like so professional. I can’t ever– The, the line is too fine and too thick all at the same time.” 

Christine: It’s kind of like how I operate where you were describing setting the roof on fire and I was like, “I feel like I would do that to make it as exciting as possible, but I wouldn’t do it properly. So I’d accidentally like set the house on fire.” 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: Like it’s like very DIY, but like you’re committing to the bit like big time. 

Em: [laughs] And it kinda works. Like some people are like– 

Christine: Right. 

Em: If it looks, if it looks close enough, nobody’s going to test it and steal something, you know? 

Christine: Right. 

Em: Anyway, uh, so maybe when in doubt, just like spray paint a Starbucks lid black, and you’ll be fine. 

Christine: I mean, I never thought of doing that, but that, um, that might be the new way to go, so, uh. 

Em: Perfect. 

Christine: I guess I’ll go to Starbucks later and, uh, get back to you. 

Em: [laughs] Okay, it’s like– It’s the new Michelle’s. It’s like just going and grabbing some art supplies. 

Christine: [laughs] The new Michelle’s. 

Em: Okay, Christine. Well, uh, you’re drinking your tea. I am supposed to be drinking an LD, but I forgot to get it from the fridge. 

Christine: [gasps] 

Em: But luckily the fridge is [pats fridge twice offscreen] right here. So– 

Christine: Oh my god. [laughs] You can touch it. 

Em: [laughs] Um, so I will probably get that, uh, at some point.

Em’s Story – The Old Faithful Inn

Em: But until then, I have a story for you. This is [spooky storytelling voice] the tale of the Old Faithful Inn.

Christine: The Old Faithful– Oh, inn! I thought you were talking about the geyser, so I was like expecting that word and then you didn’t say it. 

Em: Now, that’s interesting that you say that, Christine. That is an interesting thing you’re saying about the Old Faithful geyser. 

Christine: Continue, please. 

Em: So the Old F– 

Christine: Speak on that. 

Em: The Old– You know what? You know what I have to fucking mention right now? 

Christine: What? 

Em: To your face. 

Christine: What did I do? 

Em: To your big dumb face. You know what you have started recently? 

Christine: No. 

Em: You love to say, “Speak on that.” 

Christine: It’s so funny to me. 

Em: And it has transported into my brain, and now I say it. 

Christine: Yeah, it’s never stopped being funny. 

Em: And now it always feels like it’s in– You’re always here. Get out of my head, you know what I’m saying? 

Christine: Well, I mean, I’ve always said that. 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: And that’s what I took from you is “I’ve always said that,” is what you taught me, and I said, “That’s excellent work. I’m gonna take that as well.” 

Em: [laughs] Excellent work. Thank you. 

Christine: And then, so it’s– We sometimes just trade off like our little -isms. 

Em: I catch myself all the time now going, “Speak on that.”` 

Christine: Speak on that. 

Em: And I’m like, “Who the fuck do I think I am?” And then I– 

Christine: But it’s so good because it sort of like invites– It like critiques the other person a little bit sometimes without– 

Em: Uh-huh. 

Christine: –without like being blatantly, you know– uh, what do you call it? Confrontational. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: It’s sort of like, “Huh, why don’t you elaborate? And like you’ll hear how stupid you sound.” 

Em: [laughs] It’s– 

Christine: I mean, that’s how you usually use it like with– Like this guy, this Trumper guy I met recently, and I just kept being like, “Oh, really? Uh, speak on that.” And he was like, [stumbling over words] “Well, I don’t– Uh–“ And I was like, “See? It’s really effective.” 

Em: Yeah, it feels– 

Christine: People sometimes don’t know. 

Em: It feels like an opportunity– You’re saying like, “I’ll give you a second try.” 

Christine: Yes! Yes, try again. Oh my god. “I’ll wait.” It’s the same energy as “I’ll wait.” 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: It’s like, “Speak on that.” Continue. 

Em: [sighs] Well, I plan on speaking on the Old Faithful Inn and your interesting note about the geyser because this takes place in Yellowstone, which is in– Do you know, um, what the first U.S. national park is? 

Christine: Yellowstone. 

Em: Yeah, that’s right. Okay, so– [laughs] 

Christine: [laughs] I was like, “I fucking hope so because I really don’t know.” 

Em: Um, and the inn is named after a geyser nearby called Old Faithful. 

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Em: Uh, the geyser is called Old Faithful– Do you know why? 

Christine: Is it ’cause it’s timed? Like we know when it’s gonna go– erupt? 

Em: Should I even do my story? Like you– 

Christine: I literally don’t know. You guys, this is just off the dome. 

Em: Are you a geologist? [laughs] 

Christine: Like I’m just that smart. [laughs] 

Em: [laughs] “Off the dome”? Okay. 

Christine: [laughs] 

Em: So yes, the geyser is called Old Faithful because, unlike some geysers, this one you can predict, kind of, when it will erupt. 

Christine: I see. It’s like timed a little bit. Yeah. 

Em: Um, yeah, it’s like a vague timing because, uh, it’s like between 35 minutes and 120 minutes. But it’s like every– 

Christine: Oh, I see. So it’s like, “but it’ll happen.” 

Em: It’s like within two hours it’s gonna go off. 

Christine: Gotcha, okay. 

Em: Um, so anyway, it’s– This inn is nearby that geyser, hence the name Old Faithful Inn. 

Christine: Makes sense. 

Em: Before the Old Faithful Inn, there was another inn on the same site called the Upper Geyser Basin Hotel. And that just doesn’t have the same kind of ring, I fear. 

Christine: No, not really. No. 

Em: Uh, that was around from the 1870s to the 1890s, and then in the 1890s, the hotel, I think, caught on fire. At some point, it was so damaged that it collapsed and needed to be replaced. So the first structures of the Old Faithful Inn was built on this same lot. 

Christine: That is such a better name. You can market the Old Faithful Inn. You cannot market the Upper Geyser Basin– It’s what? The UBG? The UG– Silly. 

Em: The UGBH? 

Christine: The– It’s just no. Come on. 

Em: The “ugg-buh”? 

Christine: The “ugg-buh”? Are you serious right now? 

Em: “Catch you at the UGBH [pronounced “ugg-buh”].” 

Christine: Yeah, not gonna work. I’m gonna set it on fire and make it collapse so that we can have the other one. 

Em: Yeah, the OFI. The, the “oh-fee.” 

Christine: The “oh-fee.” 

Em: “Catch you at the OFI [pronounced “oh-fee”].” Okay. So the OFI, or the first parts of it at least, were built in 1903/1904. And this was a very famous hotel in the area. It was a very swanky– Many presidents came to visit here, um, including President Harding, President Coolidge, and both Roosevelts. You know who I always fucking forget? President Harding. 

Christine: Harding is a tough one. 

Em: I– Remember Sporcle? 

Christine: Mm, oh, I love Sporcle. You and I have played Sporcle in recent years as I recall. 

Em: Whenever I play the US Presidents version, I get every single one of them every single time except for Harding. He’s always the one that trips me up. 

Christine: I just thought– Well, I just had a thought. What if we next time– ’Cause I also always f– Well, I always forget most of them, so that’s the weird part for me is I only remember like five. And I’m like, “it’s so strange. I should know this.” 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: Um, but I– What about when you are trying to remember that one you can never remember, you’re like, “Oh, it’s really hard to remember this one.” 

Em: Ohh. 

Christine: And then you’re like, “Oh, Harding.” 

Em: Now, that has done a number to my brain immediately. 

Christine: It’s the one that’s hard to remember. ’Cause I heard myself go, “Oh, Harding’s tough.” And I’m like, “Oh my god, Harding’s a hard thing to remember.” 

Em: Now, I think you just cracked the case. 

Christine: I’m gonna be like, “Tough? President… President Difficult? President Tough?” 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: “I forget what word I used." 

Em: “President Complex? Um–” 

Christine: Complex? [laughs] “Nuanced? Convoluted?” 

Em: [laughs] Um, no, that’s a great idea, and now, because of you, I will win the, uh, trivia game if they ever say “name all 46.” Yeah. 

Christine: You’ll win the big trophy. Yeah. 

Em: Soon to be 47. 

Christine: The big Sporcle trophy. It’s about time someone do– wins it. 

Em: [sighs] Wait, is this the last episode we do before we find out the results of the election? 

Christine: I was like, “The results of what? The paternity test?” 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: My brain immediately went to paternity test. I’m like– 

Em: Okay, so you are really good at geology and kinda nothing else, uh, it sounds– [laughs] 

Christine: And nothing else. [laughs] I’m really not, no. And I, I want to be clear – I’m also not good at geology. Uh, I’m just good at guessing sometimes. Um– 

Em: Man, “off the dome.” 

Christine: Off the dome. And I’m also good at bringing back phrases nobody wants to bring back. 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: Um, what were you just saying? 

Em: I think this is the last episode before the election results. 

Christine: Oh. [inhales sharply] Yikes. Yeah, so depending on what happens, this mood could be– 

Em: Will shift. [laughs] 

Christine: –appropriate or not. So if you hear this– 

Em: It will shift like the tectonic plates. Am I right, geology expert? 

Christine: Oh my god. It’s like, it’s like, it’s like, um, a fault line is about to– It’s like a geyser that’s not Old Faithful is about to erupt any moment, and we’re all hunkering down at the GBH Inn. 

Em: You know what terrified me about the election results– or the election predictions right now? 

Christine: Mm? 

Em: NPR just came out, uh, last night saying that it’s a 2/3 chance that it’s Trump. 

Christine: Fuck my life. I literally went to tri– [unintelligible] 

Em: How is that possible? How the fuck is that possible? 

Christine: I went to the– I went to tr– therapy the other day, and I was like, “Hey, I’m– There were all sorts of things I wanted to discuss with you, but I just need to talk about the election.” And she was like, “Alright, sit down.” [laughs] And like we– 

Em: [laughs] She was like, “You and everyone else.” 

Christine: Yeah, she’s like, “Okay, another one. And here comes another one.” Um, but I was just like, “I don’t know what to do,” so she had me do a brain dump where I just wrote for pages and pages and pages and pages, and then she made me read it out loud. And I was like, “And another thing!” 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: And I was reading it out loud. But I had that same thought, Em, where I was like, “Wow, it’s way scarier than I had hoped.” I’d been avoiding it for weeks just ’cause– 

Em: I just don’t know– 

Christine: –to just wait ’til the week of, and now it’s like hitting me. And I feel like I’d drive Leona to school and like 3/4 of the signs are Trump signs. And I’m like, “I don’t feel good about that in a swing state like Ohio.” 

Em: Which like I just think I live in a false sense of reality ’cause I live in Los Angeles. And like– 

Christine: Yes, it’s a bubble. ’Cause remember when– I was talking about that in therapy too. When I lived in LA and Trump won, we were so shocked. Like I remember everyone was like– The world turned upside down. 

Em: I, I’ll never forget that day. I’ll never forget that day. 

Christine: We were sh– We were shocked. We were like, “There’s no way in hell.” And I was like we were in a bubble, like a liberal bubble, which is, you know, great until suddenly things go wrong. 

Em: I– It’s– I don’t know what to expect, and next week will obviously, um– That’ll be the reason why we drink either for something really fucking cool or really just so fucking horrible. Um. 

Christine: Yeah, so don’t take, uh, this tone that we have today as any sort of gospel, ’cause we have no clue what’s gonna happen, but, um– 

Em: That’s, that’s– You know what? That’s why I drink this week. Because I just don’t know the fate of all of our lives. 

Christine: Oh. Of– I, I’m just gonna stick with a teenager stole my s– my skeleton decoration. 

Em: [laughs] Okay. That’s a good reason. 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: [sighs] Okay. Well, you know, we’re– Let’s like send out all the, all the witches– Well, by the time you hear this Halloween’s over. But in what is probably the most powerful night in 24 hours, I hope everyone’s doing the right thing and manifesting. 

Christine: Let’s hex this shit. 

Em: Yeah. [laughs] Yes. Okay. Anyway, where were we? Presidents. President Harding. President Harding has been here. President Coolidge, the Roosevelts – both of them, father and son. Isn’t that nice? 

Christine: Aw. 

Em: Um, and over time, the inn was expanded to keep up with the growing amount of tourists going to Yellowstone. And, uh, by the way, fun fact: Yellowstone is my favorite national park. 

Christine: Really? 

Em: Do you wanna know why though? 

Christine: Yes. 

Em: Yogi Bear. 

Christine: [laughs] 

Em: And it’s because of Jellystone. 

Christine: I like– It’s a good answ– Jellystone – that’s a good answer. That’s a good answer. 

Em: I would love a Yellowstone National Park shirt that actually is just Jellystone but looks like it’s from the Yellowstone store. 

Christine: I bet they, I bet they have that. I’ll look for it. Don’t look for it, everyone. I’m doing it. 

Em: Okay! Um– 

Christine: I need more Christmas gift ideas. [laughs] 

Em: When I was, when I was little, I was obsessed with, uh, Boo Boo. So. 

Christine: Were you? 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: That’s kinda cute. I didn’t– I sorta knew that, but I didn’t really realize, um, how far the obsession went. 

Em: Uh, anyway, I, I was a big fan. So, uh, actually– Well, okay, I have to stop talking because– 

Christine: [laughs] I must, I must not continue. 

Em: [laughs] I really– I could go off on a tangent right now about Yogi Bear. 

Christine: What’s the Frog and Toad shirt I have in the– my old profile picture? Like– 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: –“‘We must stop eating,’ cried Toad as he ate another.” Like that’s us talking. 

Em: Okay, let’s talk– How ’bout this? 

Christine: “‘We must stop talking,’ I said as I kept talking.” 

Em: Let me tell you what specifically I’m obsessed about when it comes to Yogi Bear for our after-party, whatever it’s fucking called. 

Christine: Oh, the, the Yappy Hour. Yes, great idea. 

Em: Um, because she’s– It’s, it really gets me in the right spots. Okay. So over time, the inn was expanded because there were so many more tourists coming in. And it became a national landmark, and it was put on the National Registry of Historic Places. 

Christine: Makes sense. 

Em: National Register– I always say “registry”. Um, because you love this portion of my stories, I am here to tell you that construction on this inn cost $165,000 at the time, which is around $580,000 today. 

Christine: Oh, that’s not that much. I mean, it’s a lot but like not for an inn. Like I imagine– To build a whole inn? 

Em: Half a mil– Over $500,000 dollars. I mean, I guess I– I think I just have no form of reference, um, but when I think like, “Oh, four presidents have come here.” It must– That must– 

Christine: Right? 

Em: [laughs] “What’s a banana? $10? You know I have–“ [laughs] 

Christine: [laughs] 

Em: What’s $600,000? 

Christine: That’s such an underrated quote. Um, wow. 

Em: So when the hotel started up– And this is what construction and furnishings cost. 

Christine: Right. 

Em: Uh, it– The lobby– One, one of the things they did in construction is that the lobby was 85 feet tall. It had 120– 

Christine: Oh! 

Em: It had 120 rooms, which in my mind, a hotel being created at the turn of this– like 20th century, I’m like, “Hm, that feels like way too many rooms.” In my mind, there’s not 120 people. [laughs] 

Christine: It– I was gonna say, it feels like a lot of room– especially when it’s a place like with, with presidents. It feels like you would have like a very exclusive– 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Like not 100 normies staying there and then like Roosevelt and his son. 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: But I do wonder if– But also how on earth do you build like a 120-room hotel for $500,000 in today’s money? Like I don’t know. 

Em: Hm. That’s a great– 

Christine: I’m just– It’s just weird to me. But, anyway. 

Em: [asking Siri] 580,000 divided by 120. 

Christine: [laughs] 

Em: Okay, so each room– It was like $5,000. Like less than $5,000. 

Christine: There’s no way. 

Em: That, that doesn’t even include the dining room, the lobby– 

Christine: The, the– Any plumbing, any– 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Foundation. 

Em: Well, I will say, also fun fact, because that’s a great point about the money– Like how is it– How are we getting away with it at this price? 

Christine: Mm. 

Em: Because this was also one of the first hotels to have electric lighting and heat. 

Christine: See. What? 

Em: What is– 

Christine: Maybe they got some like huge grant or something. 

Em: [sighs] You know, I got a friend– 

Christine: ’Cause it’s like on, on a farm– On a farm? It’s not on a farm. It’s on a national park. [laughs] 

Em: I got a friend named Brandy, and that girl knows how to be frugal. And she is nicknamed in our friend group as Bargain Brandy. Maybe they had– 

Christine: [laughs] 

Em: Maybe they had a– 

Christine: Wait, we should call her Bargain Bin Brandy ’cause that’s way funnier. 

Em: [laughs] Well– 

Christine: Bargain Bin Brandy. 

Em: She was– 

Christine: Sounds like she’s been found at the bottom of the bargain bin. 

Em: She was literally the person through high school where she would know every Monday at Target, these are the sales. 

Christine: [groans] 

Em: But every Monday at this place, these were the sales. And every Monday at these place– 

Christine: To have a friend like that. 

Em: And she would know every day, every store. And like, I mean, she just went to the Taylor Swift Eras Tour twice because she had– The– Like growing up, she had an email for like every month, so at every restaurant, she would get 12 free meals a year. 

Christine: [laughs] 

Em: Like ’cause she had 12– She’d put one in and have a different birth month for each one of them. 

Christine: This just is exactly– 

Em: And– 

Christine: Yeah, that’s, that’s it. That’s the vibe. 

Em: And for the Eras Tour, she ended up going to Scotland and Paris to see– 

Christine: Sure. 

Em: –the, the, the Eras Tour because she literally had enough emails that she signed up for every country’s pre-sale and just hoped that she would get one of them. 

Christine: [laughs] 

Em: And she ended up getting two of them. Like she just– Like she thinks it through in a way I wouldn’t. So I– 

Christine: I was gonna say, she’s like prepared too. 

Em: I, I like to think there’s a Bargain Brandy on the team creating this place. 

Christine: I think so. Somebody is like, “Oh, we could do that. We could DIY this pyrotechnic stuff ourselves. Uh, don’t worry, guys.” 

Em: Yeah. It’s like, “120 rooms fancy enough for the, the– both the res– the Roosevelts and have electric lighting and heat? $5,000– Less than $5,000 per room.” 

Christine: “Easy peasy. Let me just get a grant from the government–“ 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: “–and, uh, we’ll figure it out.” 

Em: “Let me go to Target on Monday where this is for sale.” 

Christine: [laughs] Yeah. 

Em: “But then we go to Marshall’s here.” 

Christine: “My birthday’s actually on Wednesday, so I’ll be really busy that day. I have 16 restaurants to go to.” 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: [laughs] “But o– every other day of th-the week, I’m here.” 

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Em: Uh, in this lobby, ’cause it was– Remember I said it was an 85 foot tall lobby. 

Christine: Yes. 

Em: In this, uh, very tall lobby, up in the rafters at about foot 75– 

Christine: [laughs] Okay. 

Em: –there is a floating platform near the ceiling called the Crow’s Nest. 

Christine: Okay. Now, I’m already very intrigued about this. 

Em: Well, remember this Crow’s Nest ’cause it’s important later. 

Christine: I won’t forget it. I won’t forget it. 

Em: It’s a floating platform that, uh, during its heyday, the hotel would have string quartets and other bands perform up there, so they were essentially floating above the lobby guests. 

Christine: Wow. 

Em: And, uh, that was one of its fun little features of like, “Oh, come see live music right above you.” 

Christine: So how big is this Crow’s Nest? Like does it hold a whole band? Or is it like one person? 

Em: I guess so. I mean, I, I didn’t see a picture of it, but I imagine it’s big enough– 

Christine: Give me the square footage of this bad boy. [laughs] 

Em: [laughs] Well, I told you it’s at– It’s 75 feet up in the air. Um, that should be enough for you. 

Christine: Right, okay. That’s all I need to know actually. I don’t think I need to know any more. That’s, that’s pretty cool though. 

Em: So that was like one of its fun little features. But in 1959, there was a massive earthquake, and it created a lot of damage to the inn. And to this day, the Crow’s Nest is closed to the public. 

Christine: Oh no. 

Em: You can see it– 

Christine: But it’s still there though? 

Em: You can see it. 

Christine: Oh, cool. 

Em: It’s just collecting dust. 

Christine: That’s super cool. 

Em: On top of that, visitors, um, cannot go past the balcony on the third floor now, but what was cool about this hotel also is– 

Christine: Okay. 

Em: –that every floor had like balconies, so you could see all these balconies surrounding you. It was very beautiful. 

Christine: Oh, cool. 

Em: Um, but yeah. So you can’t go to the Crow’s Nest, and you can’t go past the third floor. 

Christine: You can’t like use the balcony at all? 

Em: I don’t think you can use the floor at all. 

Christine: Oh, bummer. 

Em: I don’t, I don’t know. I don’t– That’s the vibe I’m getting here. 

Christine: Gotcha. 

Em: Um, since it’s opening, it’s had several renovations, including this cute little thing called the Bear Pit Lounge. 

Christine: Ooh! 

Em: And it was created in 1936 and then again in 1988 when it got moved to somewhere else in the hotel. But the Bear Pit Lounge was built with a bunch of wood panel carvings, uh, quote, “of bears in the act of mischief.” 

Christine: Ah– Well, well. 

Em: Now, I love that. 

Christine: You don’t say? That sounds spectacular. 

Em: Like what do you think they’re doing? I like to think one has like their head stuck in a pot of honey like Winnie the Pooh. 

Christine: Big time. I mean, it’s all Winnie the Pooh. I imagine like– 

Em: One’s rolling down a hill. 

Christine: Themed– Yeah, for sure. One’s booty is stuck. Like he’s trying to like climb into something to get honey, and his booty got stuck. 

Em: Ooh. He’s doing the, the Baloo chair scra– the tree s– 

Christine: Oh, the scratching. 

Em: The tree scratch. Yeah. 

Christine: Just mischief. Oh, someone’s trying to like pry open a, a Jeep to get the snacks inside. 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: I’m sure, I'm sure that’s part of it. Tearing down a tent. 

Em: Like for some reason, I thought we just turned this is into like fucking true crime. Like, “Oh, now they’re also on a murder spree.” Like– [laughs] 

Christine: “Now they have knives, and they’re on cocaine.” Wait, that comes later. [laughs] 

Em: So– 

Christine: Mischief is like a vague word, you know. 

Em: It sure is. 

Christine: I don’t know if they’re sticky bears or like murderous bears, you know. It could, could be– The spectrum is wild. 

Em: [laughs] Or is it like Grand Theft Auto? Grand larceny? 

Christine: [laughs] Grand Theft Auto, um– 

Em: They have a, they have a gambling problem. The whole family is in the, in the corner crying, you know. Like something’s going on. 

Christine: Or are they just like le– [laughs] Are they just like leaving paw prints on the ground? Nobody knows. 

Em: No. Who could, who could say? Not me. 

Christine: Not me. 

Em: Um, apparently those images were then recreated through glass engravings for when they moved the Bear Pit to another area. 

Christine: Aw. 

Em: So I think, I think they still have the “act of mischief” bears. 

Christine: Love that. 

Em: So that’s kind of the only real fun facts in history that, uh, I was getting out of most of the sources here. 

Christine: Those are pretty good though. Those are good fun facts. 

Em: Here are the ghost things though. First, I’m just gonna say, there are obviously the usuals in this hotel: lights turning on and off, doors opening and closing, footsteps running down the hall but nobody’s there, creaky floors for no reason. Um– 

Christine: Do we get– Do we have a lady in white? 

Em: Girl, please. 

Christine: [laughs] 

Em: Ask yourself again if you need to ask obvious questions. 

Christine: Okay, I just– I– You’re right. I was– You’re right. 

Em: We are gonna get to her at the end because she is the main character today. 

Christine: I thought like– I just thought like when you were saying, “Oh, we have all the usuals,” I was like, oh, I was like– I was expecting you to say it there, but then I realized, you’re right. It probably has more of a story, so I’ll let it– 

Em: We have all the usuals. 

Christine: All the usuals. I’m ready. 

Em: Bold, italicized, underlined. 

Christine: I’m ready. 

Em: Um, okay. So lights, doors, footsteps, blah, blah, blah. One time, a person– This is, uh, super– This is the one that would absolutely have me losing my mind. 

Christine: Okay. 

Em: One person was walking through. Apparently, she was inspecting the ho– Like she was on– doing an inspection of the hotel. They called her an “inspectress,” which I thought was special. 

Christine: Love. 

Em: And this inspectress, she– 

Christine: It’s like when I tried to be Inspectress Gadget. 

Em: [laughs] It’s like when you were a private ins-inspect– 

Christine: Inspectress. 

Em: –inspectress. [laughs] Okay– 

Christine: It has a good ring to it. I like it. 

Em: Well, so she was walking around the hotel, and she saw a fire extinguisher on the wall lift off of its handle very slowly, turn itself 90 degrees– 

Christine: [gasps] 

Em: –and then turn itself back and hang on the handle lid again. 

Christine: What? 

Em: Like are you kidding me? That would be all I– 

Christine: Why? 

Em: I-Inspectress? Um, what does this mean, uh, Miss I’m-The-Inspector-And-I-Know-How-To-Inspect? After– 

Christine: I spoke too soon. 

Em: After inspecting that, inspect the fucking door and leave and run. 

Christine: I was gonna say, inspect my car ’cause I’m driving home. 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: Um, I– Wow. That's pretty weird. And I think I’m, I’m with you that that would be what did it because it’s like, were you just showing me that to show me? 

Em: Right. [laughs] 

Christine: Like were you doing s– Was it supposed to mean something? Like it just– 

Em: Like did I walk in on a ghost janitor like working? Or were you– Was that a show for me? 

Christine: Like s-s– Right! It– Like that would really freak me out. 

Em: I feel like if I realized that that was them trying to– And then once it’s– Like if it’s on display for me, was that to scare me? Or am I supposed to go like, [applauds] “Ohhh”? Like– 

Christine: Right. Or are they like, “Oh, the screw’s loose. Somebody fix it”? Like are you trying to tell me something? Is this like– Are you threatening me? Like I, like I don’t know what it means. 

Em: The vibe could be anything. 

Christine: Anything. 

Em: It’s, it’s an– It could be an act of mischief. It could’ve been those damn bears. 

Christine: [laughs] Oh, it could be a fucking bear. 

Em: Uh, so that’s like the creepiest thing for me. But the main thing here is that people see apparitions. A lot of people see a little boy who will run up to you and ask where his family is, and then he vanishes. 

Christine: Oh no. 

Em: That– There’s always gotta be a sad one. 

Christine: Gotta be. 

Em: Then there’s several apparitions of men either in the lobby or the halls. One is very short, but he looks very serious, probably because he’s so short. 

Christine: [laughs] 

Em: And [laughs] another one is a man in a merchant marine uniform. Uh, so there’s a, a few male apparitions, and it could be– We don’t know who it is, but there are a few potentials for who these men are. 

Christine: Okay. 

Em: So one of the first thoughts is it could be the inn’s architect, Robert Reamer. Um, it could be a ranger who was stationed here in the 1920s named Ranger Phillips. 

Christine: Ooh. 

Em: And he, uh– When stationed here, he died of hemlock poisoning because he thought he was eating a parsnip, and it was hemlock. 

Christine: Noo. That’s like pretty fucking tragic. 

Em: Kids, don’t eat your vegetables. They could be poison. 

Christine: [laughs] 

Em: Uh, it could also be a guy named LR Piper, who was a guy who just, uh, vanished in 1900. He just disappeared. No one ever saw him again. 

Christine: Oh. 

Em: And a lot of people think that maybe he fell into the nearby geyser– 

Christine: [gasps] No… 

Em: –which, um, fun fact: mid-eruption, it can hit, uh, upwards of like 250 degrees Fahrenheit (which is about 120 degrees Celsius). 

Christine: Okay. 

Em: Um, and people think maybe he just fell into a geyser. And the only reason we think it could be him is because one kid reported seeing the apparition of a man who looked like he had severe scalding injuries. 

Christine: [gasps] Oh, that’s dark. 

Em: But that’s also assuming that he actually did die that way. [a thumbs-up emoji appears in a bubble next to Em’s face] 

Christine: You just– [laughs] You just gave a thumbs-up. You just gave a thumbs– [laughs] 

Em: [sighs] 

Christine: It’s always the worst timing. Yeah, it’s like thumbs up a-as you’re talking about somebody with like third-degree burns all over his body. 

Em: [laughs] Yeah. I– That– 

Christine: Oops. 

Em: And it’s when I’m actively trying to do this. [Em makes a thumbs-down gesture with their hand] It’s not– Nothing’s happening, you know? So. 

Christine: Yeah. It’s– It doesn’t have room for a negative reaction. 

Em: So the apparition of a man could also be a random frontiersman who is allegedly buried on the property. Because at some point when they did an addition in like the 1910s/1920s, they realized that there were unmarked graves under the property. Whoopsie-daisies. 

Christine: Oh, cool, cool, cool. 

Em: And then built on top of it anyway. So they think that maybe it’s one of those people who’s buried under the hotel. Um, it could be a random guy who just died from some adventure accident nearby because he’s in Yellowstone, you know. 

Christine: Right. 

Em: Or maybe it’s, um, maybe there’s several apparitions of men, and it is all these people all the time. Porque no los cinco, you know? 

Christine: [laughs] That’s what I always say. 

Em: [laughs] I’ve always said that. 

Christine: [laughs] 

Em: Uh, there’s also the spirit of a woman in Room 2. Now, this one is the second most famous story here. This is– When a, a couple went to bed in Room 2, and the woman woke up in the middle of the night. And she saw a woman floating over her bed in like old-school clothing. 

Christine: Mm-hmm. 

Em: A lot of the sources say 1890s clothing, but I swear to god if I ever saw someone in old-ass clothing, I would never be able to go, “Obviously 1890s,” you know? 

Christine: Yeah. “The lace had, uh, a specific stitching to it,” you know? It’s like, “How on earth would you even know?” 

Em: [laughs] No, I, I would barely even notice that they had clothing if someone was standing o-over my bed. Like– 

Christine: [laughs] 

Em: I’m– I don’t know what fucking year it’s from. So, uh, anyway, they– All the websites tried to make this story seem much scarier than it is because they all like really lean into like [dramatic voice] “she was digging her nails into her husband’s back ’cause she was so scared, and then he woke up. And they showed the hotel staff his scratches down his back because she was so scared.” I’m like, okay, we’re doing a lot of talking about everything and nothing. Like I get it. There was a woman floating over the bed. We could have ended it there. 

Christine: Right. So it– The scratches were from the wife, not from the ghost. 

Em: From the wife being scared, yeah. I, I– 

Christine: Oh, okay. Okay. 

Em: It felt like– 

Christine: Yeah, the number of times I’ve harmed someone because I’m scared– That’s not story worthy, you know. 

Em: I, I feel like– 

Christine: I, I harm you all the time when I’m scared, like just with my claws. 

Em: Mm. [laughs] I, I– It felt like a lot of those sources were like trying to hit a word count, and they were like, “Let’s talk about the woman and her nails.” 

Christine: [laughs] 

Em: And I'm like, “We said everything already in the beginning: there was a woman floating over her bed. 1890s garb.” 

Christine: Yeah, we’re all scared. I– Don’t worry. We get it. It’s scary. 

Em: So apparently, because of that, Room 2 is one of the bigger ones that people request if you wanna find a ghost because they think they’ll find her. People don’t know who this woman in 19– in 1890s clothes could be, but they think it might be a woman named Mrs. Culver who died not too far from the area in the 18– in 1889 – so 1890s clothing, I guess. 

Christine: Mm. 

Em: Um, she died not too far from the area during childbirth. And allegedly, when she died, the grounds were too frozen to bury her right away– 

Christine: [gasps] 

Em: –and so they buried her instead in – this is multiple – pickle barrels. 

Christine: Oh my god. What? 

Em: So like at some point– Does that mean they like dismembered her to put her in multiple barrels? 

Christine: I– Yeah, the fact that it says “barrels” is alarming. Like I don’t know. 

Em: Um, and they put her in those barrels basically until the ground thawed. 

Christine: Well, maybe they just put them like side by side– 

Em: Ohh. 

Christine: –and then put her inside them. 

Em: That’s– And then they just roll her down the hill. Yeah, I don’t know. 

Christine: I guess? Right? 

Em: I have no idea. 

Christine: Like what are you doing with that barrel? Or– I don’t know. Weird. 

Em: Who had two empty pickle barrels and was like, “I know exactly what I’m– I’m not gonna fill these with pickles.” 

Christine: Probably you in a past life. You probably ate all of them. 

Em: That’s a great point. I actually still remember as a kid grab– like having like that communal barrel of pickles in the grocery store, and everyone would just stick their bare hands in it. 

Christine: So weird. 

Em: COVID could never. Like I can’t– 

Christine: Their bare hands? It’s just bears– 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: –taking all the pickles. 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: They just ate all the pickles. 

Em: Yeah, the– Actually, the, the wood panel carvings is a collaboration between me and the bears causing mischief. 

Christine: [laughs] Yeah, you kinda keep showing up. 

Em: The second there’s a pickle barrel, all of a sudden, it’s game over. 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: Anyway, so she was put in these barrels until a good thaw– 

Christine: That’s wild. 

Em: –and then they ultimately did bury her in the ground. 

Christine: So she was just like above ground in these barrels for a while. Eugh. 

Em: I’m thinking so. And it was so cold outside, I guess she was frozen, so it’s not like there was a smell or anything. 

Christine: Right. 

Em: But– So she ended up– She j– is just someone who randomly died nearby, and this is the story of how she was buried. 

Christine: Ugh [sighs]. 

Em: And, uh, the end of the story is that she does get buried. And now the water that she’s buried near is called Dead Maiden’s Spring, by the way. 

Christine: Whoa. 

Em: Um, but so they think that this woman could be the ghost that someone saw in Room 2. That’s, that’s their guess. 

Christine: Okay. Okay. 

Em: Um, the most famous room here is Room 127, which is the story of the lady in white, of course. 

Christine: Mm. 

Em: Um, she is known as the Headless Bride. 

Christine: Oh– 

Em: That’s– So I guess– 

Christine: –dear. 

Em: –at least she’s original compared to the Lady in White. 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: Um, but the story goes that in 1914, she was a New York socialite, fell in love with a guy who her family didn’t approve of. Apparently, he was like a servant that worked for their family. So– 

Christine: Ohh. Below her station. 

Em: Like drama under the roof. Like there’s no escaping that. 

Christine: Yeah, like Downton Abbey level drama. 

Em: [laughs] And so, uh– Anyway, her family did not approve obviously. 

Christine: Mm. 

Em: They, uh– Maybe– I think that in one source I saw that they even tried to like set her up in an arranged marriage just to get her away from him– 

Christine: Oof. 

Em: –but then that obviously didn’t work out. Basically, her father was especially nervous because he thought that the servant in love, quote, with his daughter was only, quote, in love with her for the family’s money. 

Christine: Right. 

Em: And like, “Well, if I marry, then, you know, then I’m in.” 

Christine: I’m in. 

Em: She, apparently, was like, “I don’t give a fuck. I’m marrying him anyway.” And the father was like, “Okay, I’ll let you marry him, and I’m gonna give him a handsome dowry.” Because remember, dowry? 

Christine: Mm. 

Em: Um, “But if I do this, you are out of the will, and you can never return to New York.” 

Christine: [gasps] 

Em: Like he’s the fucking king. Okay, there’s five boroughs. Find me, bitch. 

Christine: Oh, what a dick. 

Em: In 1914, you could live– 

Christine: And– [laughs] What did you say? “There’s five boroughs. Find me, bitch.” 

Em: [laughs] Yeah. 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: I was like in 1914– First of all, who are you to tell me where I can and can’t live? Second of all, like I could live across the street, and we just might never see each other, and you would never know. 

Christine: Yeah. It’s called New York, you know. 

Em: Like what? You’re the mob and you’ve got eyes everywhere? Okay. So, um, anyway– 

Christine: I literally just picture you eating a fucking pickle out of a barrel. Like, “Really? You think you can tell me where to go?” 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: Oh my god. 

Em: And I've always said that. So. 

Christine: [laughs] 

Em: Um, anyway he was like, “You can never come back to New York, and you’re out of the will if you marry this guy.” And I think his original plan was like if he told the guy she’s cut out of the will, then he would be uninterested in marrying her because he wouldn’t have access to her money. 

Christine: Ah. Okay. 

Em: Um, and then he would go away, and the problem would go away. 

Christine: Right, right, right. He was like playing his, playing his– 

Em: He was, uh– Hm. 

Christine: What’s the word? 

Em: He was bluffing in a way. 

Christine: Yeah, what’s– His– Calling his bluff. 

Em: Yes. The couple got married anyway. They honeymoon in Yellowstone. Obviously, they stay at the OFI, the Old Faithful Inn. 

Christine: [laughs] Of course. 

Em: And, and the groom immediately starts spending all the dowry money. Um, some of the sources say that it was through gambling, something like that. 

Christine: Intriguing. 

Em: “Like them damn bears! I’ll tell ya.” 

Christine: [sighs] 

Em: And somehow, I guess they were honeymooning for like a month– Maybe that’s just what you did in 1914 when it took three months to get there. 

Christine: I think you do honeymoon for– You would honeymoon for a while ’cause you would take like a sea voyage or like– 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: –a train voyage somewhere, and it would always take longer. 

Em: Well, so they were there for a m– at least a month, and in that month, he spent all of the dowry– 

Christine: [gasps] 

Em: –to a point where they couldn’t even afford the hotel bill on their honeymoon. 

Christine: During the honeymoon? Oh no. 

Em: So the hotel staff heard the couple fighting nonstop. 

Christine: [inhales sharply] 

Em: And some versions of the story say that the daughter even called home for more money but was refused. 

Christine: Ooh, f– You know that didn’t go over well with Dad. 

Em: Yeah, Dad was like, “Well, well, well.” 

Christine: “Told you so. Told you so.” 

Em: Either way, during one of these fights, the husband storms out of the hotel in the middle of the night and is to never be seen again. The staff don’t see the wife for a while, so they’re like, “Okay, we’re gonna give her some space.” But eventually, they’re like, “It’s kinda weird we haven’t seen her. We’re gonna go check on her.” 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: They find her in the bathtub. 

Christine: [gasps] 

Em: Homegirl is decapitated. 

Christine: No. 

Em: And her head is nowhere to be seen. 

Christine: No! 

Em: So the staff look everywhere. Uh, and a week later, guests start to complain of a smell in the lobby in the Crow’s Nest. 

Christine: No! 

Em: And they send someone up there. 

Christine: You’re kidding me. 

Em: Wham, bam, thank you, ma’am. That’s where her head was. 

Christine: [gasps] 

Em: And to this day, the Headless Bride is said to haunt the Old Faithful Inn. People will see a bride, aka woman in white, wandering the halls. And– 

Christine: Oh, shit. 

Em: She’s often seen by the Crow’s Nest, either looking over its railing down to the lobby or coming down the stairs attached to the Crow’s Nest. But she is best recognized by the fact that she is always seen carrying her own head. 

Christine: [gasps] Ah, how dark is that? 

Em: People say when they hear footsteps through the hotel it must be her wandering the halls, either in search of her head before she found it or in search of her groom or in search of– I don’t know. The money that he stole. I don’t fucking know. But she’s walking around. 

Christine: Mm! 

Em: Um, guests and staff alike have claimed to see her. One waitress says that from the corner of her eye, she has seen a woman in a frilly white dress. 

Christine: Mm. 

Em: Um, all this to say though, I don’t know if this guy’s just trying to ruin it for everyone. I don’t know what the fucking deal is. There’s a guy named George Bornemann. And George– Different sources say different things about him. He was either the former manager, the former assistant manager, the former tour guide, the former bell captain, or the former bellman, which maybe bell captain and bellman are the same thing. 

Christine: Did he have former assistant to the general manager? 

Em: Yeah– [laughs] Yes. Well, apparently George claims that he made up the Headless Bride story when he worked there. 

Christine: What? 

Em: Now, we don’t e– I– We don’t even know if that’s true. I mean, like once you– Now that you’re claiming something that you’re claiming about something that’s already claimed. 

Christine: Right. 

Em: It’s like an alleged on an alleged. It’s like– And now we don’t know for sure. But– 

Christine: Yeah, way to like muddy the waters, friend. 

Em: Yeah, you couldn’t just let people have a good fucking time? You had to like– 

Christine: Ugh, no. You gotta insert yourself. 

Em: –put your name in there? 

Christine: Really? 

Em: He apparently– He says that in 1983 he was staying overnight in the hotel. He was totally by himself – maybe there was one other person there. Um, but he had a weird experience where he actually was hearing footsteps in the halls, even though nobody should be there. He kept running out to see what was going on. He could have sworn an actual person had gotten into the hotel somehow, and he eventually followed the footsteps to the lobby. And apparently– 

Christine: Oh… 

Em: –although all that is true, it made– As he walked to the lobby, he looked up into the Crow’s Nest, and he– I don’t know. He looked up into the Crow’s Nest, and that’s the end of the real story. But what he now tells people is that he saw this white misty figure holding a head walking down the stairs. He really embellished it for the story. 

Christine: And he’s saying he made that part up? 

Em: He’s saying he made that part up. 

Christine: I see. Okay. 

Em: Now, timeline gets tricky. It sounds like he had the footsteps thing actually happen to him– 

Christine: Right. 

Em: –and it freaked him out so much he started researching the hotel, which is where he found out that in 1915 there actually was a murder in the hotel. 

Christine: Ohh, okay, okay. 

Em: And from that, it inspired the second half of the story. So then when he started telling people a story, all of a sudden, it became this much more embellished version of it. 

Christine: I see, I see. So is he saying like, “Oh, it just got out of hand”? Or like– 

Em: No, I think he actively made it up because so many– 

Christine: Oh my god. 

Em: –so many guests would come t– over to him and ask, “Is the hotel haunted?” And he got so sick of it that eventually he was like, “Yeah, it’s haunted. I saw a fucking headless bride. Now leave me alone.” Like a– 

Christine: “Now get over it.” [laughs] 

Em: Which I kinda don’t blame him. I, I mean, I– As the– As a third party, I’m like, “Aw, fuck this guy.” 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: But at the same time, if I worked at a hotel and everyone was asking me a million times over– It’s kind of like when I go into a lift by myself, sometimes I just make up a fucking story about my life. 

Christine: Right. It’s like, “I don’t even wanna have this conversation again.” 

Em: Like they’re like, “Oh, what are you here for?” and I’m like, “Oh, I am a flight attendant.” 

Christine: “Visiting family. The end.” 

Em: Like I just make a fucking story sometimes. 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: Um, or if someone says like, “Oh, I’m from Kentucky,” I’ll just steal your life, and I go, “Oh, I’m from there. I’m from Covington.” Like I just make it up. [laughs] 

Christine: Oh god. [laughs] Great. I did not know this. Okay. So, um, next time somebody shows up and is like, “Em, it’s so great to see you again,” I’ll be like, “Oh. Well, Em had taken my identity.” 

Em: Well, only if it’s like– I mean, if it’s like literally a Lyft driver or something– It’s someone I’m never gonna see again. 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: So in– 

Christine: I love this. You’re just like creating a mystery about yourself. 

Em: I just get bored sometimes. Or like I don’t want to explain what I’m doing there, and it’s just easier to say something else. 

Christine: I get it. I get it. 

Em: Or I'll say like, “oh, I’m visiting my–“ A, a go-to is usually “I’m visiting my brother. He goes to college around here.” Like I just– 

Christine: Yeah, I feel like visiting family is the easy one ’cause it’s like nobody really cares. I mean, not that– you know. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Nobody cares to ask a bunch of questions about that really. 

Em: But so, but I feel like this guy is probably like, “I work at this fucking hotel. Everyone won’t stop asking if it’s haunted.” 

Christine: I see. 

Em: Like, “Let’s just make something up just to give them something,” 

Christine: Right, okay. 

Em: So in that way, I’m not too upset. But it does, like you said, muddy up the waters, and we don’t know. 

Christine: Yeah. It’s kind of annoying. 

Em: So, uh, we don’t know how much of it is true. 

Christine: Especially if he’s like, “I only made up part of it.” It’s like, “Well–“ [sighs] 

Em: Yeah, so like now we– 

Christine: –“now it’s extra confusing.” 

Em: According to him, the footsteps thing did, in fact, happen, and people do still hear footsteps all the time. 

Christine: Right. 

Em: So that tracks. But people do actually see a white misty ghost in a white dress coming down the stairs holding a head now. 

Christine: Yeah, so it’s– 

Em: So we don’t know if it’s like because he put that in their brains to see, or is that true and he tried to steal the story? We don’t know. 

Christine: Or did he like manifest something that wasn’t there? 

Em: Oh? Yeah, that too. Well, so there’s no way to know for sure that the woman in white, uh, lady in white is totally true, but people swear they run into her anyway. And if you would like to, your best bet is Room 127 where she died. 

Christine: I’m okay. But thanks. 

Em: And last thing I’m gonna say is before you go, heads-up: the inn does not have ghost tours, and they do not book official ghost hunts. So if you wanted to– 

Christine: [laughs] George is like, “Abs– Over my dead fucking body.” 

Em: So if you ever wanted to actually go ghost hunting there, you’re gonna have to do it in secret. So. 

Christine: Don’t mind if I do. 

Em: And that is the Old Faithful Inn. 

Christine: That was cool. That was very cool. Thank you for sharing. 

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Christine: I, uh, I didn’t know about that. I didn’t know that anything by the geyser was haunted. I just assume places like parks are just outdoor places with no ghosts. 

Em: I feel like national parks are like always said to be haunted, and I’ve heard people say like, “Oh, you should do like a–“ Like even like with Appalachia in general or something– 

Christine: Mm. 

Em: –they’re like, “Oh, can you do a general–“ 

Christine: Right. 

Em: But I, I hate doing those where it’s like, “Let me just tell you about a location.” Like I would rather focus in on a story because– 

Christine: Es– Yeah, like an actual– 

Em: I also don’t– Selfishly, I don’t want to burn through material. 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: Like if there’s like ten different stories, I don’t want to do them all in one episode. I’d rather– 

Christine: So if there’s like a family in Appalachia that has some story, it’s like– 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: –more fun to cover just that. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Interesting. Yeah. 

Em: Alright– 

Christine: Well, where are the night– Where are the, th-the, the Fresno Nightcrawler? He’s in, uh– 

Em: Fresno? 

Christine: Fresno, yes. [laughs] 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: Um, what’s the national park he was spotted in though? Uh– 

Em: I don’t– I thought he was in someone’s backyard. 

Christine: Oh, Yosemite. Yosemite. No, remember? ’Cause, um, it was Yosemite because they had like a trail cam set up, and somebody captured it. 

Em: Yes, that– Well, that’s why I thought backyard ’cause I thought it was like a Ring doorbell or something. 

Christine: But the reason that it like was so alarming is ’cause like it was an official park– 

Em: That’s weird. 

Christine: –trail cam. Like it wasn’t just somebody’s doorbell that they like, you know, faked. It was like, “How did this happen?”

Christine’s Story – Victoria Cilliers Part 2

Christine: Okay. Well, Em. I– This is gonna be an experiment because I’m doing part two of–

Em: From like three weeks ago or something, yeah. 

Christine: [laughs] Yeah. Uh, yeah. And I don’t know if you remember anything at all about the story? Probably not. 

Em: I remember, uh– 

Christine: I mean, once I remind you, I’m sure you’ll know some of it. 

Em: I remember that the main character, the girl, was, um, in a nasty relationship with a guy who seemed very disinterested in her. 

Christine: Very abusive. 

Em: She was, um, kind of like a, a bad bitch who, uh– 

Christine: Mm-hmm. 

Em: –had a lot of like license, licenses and certificates for skydiving. 

Christine: Mm-hmm. 

Em: And then, um, she went– He like really weirdly like pushed her to go skydiving one day. 

Christine: Mm-hmm. 

Em: And when she did, her pack and her backup never opened. And– 

Christine: You fucking nailed it. 

Em: And h– And it’s obviously him. I just don’t know how. 

Christine: And here we are. So this is part two. I’m so glad– Thank you for giving me a recap– like giving all of us the recap so I didn’t have to. That was not my intention at first, but as you were doing it, I was like, “Oh, this is actually a lot easier.” Um, and you said just about as much as I c– would have remembered to say, so thank you. We’re getting into part two. I’m sorry, folks, for the Halloween interruption, but, um, you know, it was necessary. It was the one time of year that things are allowed to get pushed aside for Halloween, so. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: We’re on part two. Victoria has survived this tremendous crash from thousands of feet in the air, uh, with no parachute, which is just unheard of. 

Em: Which how did she survive? Like what did s– What– Was she– What did she land on? 

Christine: It’s, it’s like shocking. Like they– Remember when I was saying last time that the guy who went out as emergency services brought a body bag from the car over? 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: ’Cause he was like, “Well, there’s no way she’s survived this.” 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: “Or if she did, there’s no way she’s going to live long,” you know. 

Em: Right. 

Christine: Um, so they were like– It wa– it was one of those, you know, miracle situations where you just plummeted past from 4,000 feet– 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: –past all the other skydivers, and somehow survived. I mean, I did– As we talked about, I sk– I went skydiving. I barely survived, and I had a perfectly fine parachute. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: But I just puked my guts out at the bottom. So– 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: I don’t know how she did it, but she did. So she’s in the hospital, and, um, she wakes up in the ER. And guess who’s there? Her loving husband, Emile. Aww. 

Em: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. 

Christine: And– 

Em: She had to look at him at this point and go, “I’m fucking on to you.” Or did she have no idea? 

Christine: Nope. Nope. 

Em: Wow. 

Christine: Not yet. Uh– 

Em: [sighs] 

Christine: I think it was just so shocking of a, an idea, and like– I mean, we’ll get into it, but it took her a while to really come to terms with it, as you would imagine. Somebody that you like trust with your children– 

Em: Sure. 

Christine: –and your life and trying to tell yourself like, “Nope, it’s all been a lie,” you know. Um, but so I don’t– I think I had mentioned this last time that when they call– when the skydiving location called him on the phone, he was like very weird about it. 

Em: Yeah, he like didn’t give a shit or something, or he was like, “Okay,” and then just hung up the phone. 

Christine: He, he like was just like almost upset that she like– I think, looking back, he was upset she had survived. Like he was like taken aback because he was waiting to get a call about– and probably preparing his lines for like, “Oh, your wife has passed.” And then they’re like “Oh, she’s, she’s okay. She’s not– She’s gonna be fine. She’s gonna be fine,” over and over. And he was like, “Okay, I get it.” [laughs] Like, “She’s gonna be fine. Great.” You know? 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: Um– 

Em: “Yuck. Tell me something I don’t know.” [laughs] 

Christine: “Yuck, let me get back to feeding the baby.” So she wakes up. She’s in the ER, and Emile is at her side. He’s texting on his phone. And when he sees her wake up, the first thing he does: he complains about how long he’s had to be there. 

Em: [laughs] I’m sorry. That’s not funny. That’s literally– 

Christine: [laughs] It’s like– It’s not funny in the most funny way. It’s like, “You sicko. Get a grip, dude.” 

Em: It's like that, um, that episode of Friends when Rachel’s having her baby and Ross like hits his head, and he’s like, “you have no idea how painful this is.” 

Christine: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 

Em: It’s like, “Um… Hello?” 

Christine: Very similar vibes. 

Em: No– God. 

Christine: Yeah, like, “I’m stuck in this hospital. I’m so bored. I’m out of Candy Crush lives.” Like are you serious, guy? 

Em: [laughs] Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

Christine: [sighs] So Victoria apologized from her hospital bed– 

Em: Disgusting. 

Christine: –feeling guilty and embarrassed because she was like, “I don’t think I’m even seriously injured. Like I don’t know why I’m– I’ve been here for so long.” Um, she didn’t feel any pain, and Emile did not explain her condition to her at all or like what had happened. He basically– All he told her is that (a) he was there for far too long, and he was so bored. And then he told her that April and Ben, the kids, were with his ex-wife, Carly, who sometimes helped with the children. Victoria’s very grateful for that, that they were being taken care of. So Emile said that Victoria’s father and stepmother would pick up the kids soon, and Victoria was surprised that Emile called them. And when Victoria asked why you would call the parents to, to come and step in, Emile didn’t elaborate, um, like how severe her injuries had been. Like she didn’t really understand what had happened ’cause she had just woken up after this accident. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: And she wasn’t sure like how badly she was injured, and he wasn’t fucking telling her. And he only told her she had a bad fall. And like that’s it. Uh, but she heard that and was like, “Okay. I had a bad fall. Well, I wanna get home to my kids. Why did you have to bring the grandparents in?” Like, “I’ll be home soon. I can watch them.” 

Em: Right, like– 

Christine: Like she doesn’t get it ’cause he’s not fucking helping her get it. It just makes me so mad. 

Em: Also is she, is she aware of like how severe the fall wa–? Like did she lose memory or something? 

Christine: No, he, he just said like, “O-oh, it was a bad fall.” And she’s like sort of remembers, but she’s like, “I don’t know–“ She didn’t think she was hurt badly or anything. Like she was just like, “Why am I still in this hospital bed?” 

Em: Like, like he’s not saying, “You plummeted from the fucking sky.” He– She just thinks that she tripped or something. 

Christine: Yeah, and he’s not saying like, “You can’t move, and you can’t go home.” Like he’s just saying, [groans] “Yeah, we’ve been here forever.” And so, of course, with that attitude especially from him, she’s thinking– 

Em: Yeah, and not knowing that she’s hurt, yeah. 

Christine: –“This is such a waste of t– my time. Why am I in here? Why are you calling my parents? Like we should just get home and get to the kids.” So Ben was only a few weeks old, the baby. And so he was still– She was still breastfeeding, and she was like, “I wanna get home to the baby.” Like, “I don’t wanna be here. I wanna check out of the hospital.” But then a doctor shows up, finally, uh, instead of this fucking Emile guy, and the doctor explains,”Oh, well, you’re not in any pain and you feel fine because you’re on a tremendously high dose of fentanyl on an IV drop.” 

Em: [gasps] 

Christine: “That’s why you don’t feel any pain. Uh, actually several vertebrae of your spine are broken.” 

Em: [gasps] 

Christine: “Your pelvis is broken and requires surgery. And several of your ribs are broken.” One of her lungs is collapsed. And it’s like– This guy, Emile, is just sitting there, bitching about like, “Ugh, god. I had to call a babysitter.” It’s like– I can’t. I can’t with this guy. 

Em: I can’t even– 

Christine: It’s like you did this. He did this! 

Em: Like I– The way that I would look at him though, and I would go, “Why are you trying to rush me out if you know all this? Like you’re looking at me, and you can see how bad it is. Why are–“ 

Christine: My broken pelvis? Like seriously? And she just gave birth a few weeks ago, and she’s already struggling postpartum. 

Em: Did she get a C-section? 

Christine: Um, no, I don’t– I don’t remember honestly. It said– I think it said a– 

Em: Because I’m just like imagine the additional trauma to a body that just went through that. 

Christine: I believe it was– From what I remember, it was like a moderately difficult birth, but I don’t know. There weren’t any details. 

Em: I mean, all birth is– 

Christine: Yeah, right. It’s– 

Em: She’s already– 

Christine: –pretty moderately difficult. [laughs] 

Em: [laughs] Yeah. 

Christine: Anyway, so the doctor tells her this, and she’s like shocked. Um, the doctor looks at Victoria and said the brace stabilizing her pelvis looked too tight. So when he starts loosening the brace on her pelvis, she’s just like overcome with pain. Like– 

Em: [gasps] 

Christine: –that, that’s when she feels it. 

Em: Oh my god. 

Christine: And that’s when it like hits her, “Oh, shit. I’m actually really hurt. Like I can’t just get up.” ’Cause she felt okay, you know. And so she thought, “Uh-oh. I thought I was all right and I could go see my baby, but nope.” Uh, she’s in severe pain. She’s not as unscathed as she had once believed. 

Em: [groans] Oh… 

Christine: And not as unscathed as Emile had tried to make it seem. Um, probably ’cause now he doesn’t wanna get caught, right? 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: And he’s thinking, “Uh-oh. No, it wasn’t a big deal. I just accidentally let you fall from the sky, and it’s fine. You j– You’re just a little scratched up.” Um, the full weight of her injuries settled in when the staff needed to move her from the bed in the emergency room to the ICU. And Victoria later wrote that when she– when they lifted and rolled her between the beds– 

Em: [groans] Oh! 

Christine: –she started screaming like a wild animal because it was so painful that like she didn’t even recognize the sounds coming out of her body. Um, and E-Emile, uh, was on his phone, and he didn’t look up from his phone the whole time. 

Em: [sighs] Oh my god. 

Christine: I just imagine like healthcare workers who see this kind of thing all the time– not, not, not this, not falling from the sky 4,000 feet all the time, but like see dysfunctional relationships and like partners who are clearly toxic or abusive, it’s just– It must be so frustrating to see someone treated that way when you know how in pain they are and how sick they are. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Um, so props to all of you who have to deal with that every day. So despite the agony Victoria was in, she was embarrassed because the hospital staff was like horrified about her husband’s behavior. 

Em: Mm. 

Christine: Like I was just saying. Like they’re watching this asshole, and she’s like trying to say like, “Oh, he’s just really busy,” you know, like making excuses. And Vic– Little did she know he had fucking done this to her to begin with, but whatever. So Victoria spent her initial recovery in the ICU on full spinal care to avoid further damage and because they didn’t want her to get paralyzed, you know. Her spine’s already damaged. If it gets any further damage, she might become paralyzed. So when she moved from the ICU and began weaning off the IV pain medication, she was hoping Emile would start visiting and encourage her recovery, her, uh, physical therapy, but he didn’t fucking show. 

Em: Of course not. 

Christine: He just didn’t. He just stayed home. 

Em: I could’ve told you that wasn’t gonna happen. 

Christine: I know. Like least surprising fact of this case. Victoria pushed through grueling physical therapy, putting everything she had into getting home to her children. ‘Cause she had weeks-old baby that she was missing now at home, and she’s missing weeks of his life. Um, and they couldn’t visit in the hospital with the baby because he was y– too b– He was a teeny, teeny, little one, and she’s in the ICU, you know. 

Em: Also like such a small thing to also pay attention to, but imagine being in that kind of pain – also you’re still probably– your body’s still recovering from childbirth– 

Christine: Yep. 

Em: –and, like I’ve never had to experience this, but I mean, she’s also like breastfeeding and not near her baby. Christine: Yeah. 

Em: Like imagine the– 

Christine: You’ve witnessed me bitching about it. 

Em: –the uncomfort– the discomfort of that like– just like– 

Christine: You’d– And, and then you get infections if you don’t like take– get it out. So if you’re in fucking coma or you’re– I mean, that could get infected. Like it’s just– That’s– You’re right. It’s like on top of everything else. 

Em: It’s just like– It’s like how many– 

Christine: And it also reminds you your hormones are like kicking in to be like “Go to your baby. Go to your baby.” 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: “Your baby needs to eat.” And it’s like you can’t. And so it’s this extra like turmoil on top of it. 

Em: Like there’s just so many levels of discomfort and frustration that like– 

Christine: [throws small towel offscreen] Sorry, I just had to throw a towel at Juniper ’cause he’s eating my plant. 

Em: Oh. I like how you’re like, “the maternal instincts”– 

Christine: [picks up small, empty cardboard box as she watches Juniper offscreen] 

Em: –and you’re like, “Let me throw everything I have at my cat.” 

Christine: And then I just like thwack– [tosses cardboard towards Juniper] Get away! Okay, it worked. 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: Sorry. I’m so sorry. He’s just such a dick sometimes. Um, anyway. Yes, I’m with you. It’s, it’s like, u-uh, it seems minor, but in the moment, I imagine that was also very painful to have on top of all the other pain. So when she was finally, finally cleared to leave the hospital, she called Emile excitedly, and he told her he was too busy to talk. [laughs] Such a dick. And, uh– 

Em: I like can’t imagine– I can’t imagine. 

Christine: He says, “I’m too busy to talk. But not only that, I’m actually too busy to pick you up, so I’ll pick you up in three days.” 

[silence] 

Em: [sighs] 

Christine: What? 

Em: I don’t know. I mean, does this story end with her actually being the true criminal? Does she murder him? 

Christine: I was gonna say– I– You know, part of me wishes, but unfortunately not. So when Victoria did finally get home and her parents left, Emile was very impatient with her recovery, basically like “get over it.” Um, Victoria felt like a burden. She did her best to stay out of the way while Emile cared for the kids. And one day, interestingly enough, a knock on the door. Hey, it’s the representatives from the British Parachute Association. 

Em: Oh. [laughs] 

Christine: Huh. “Welcome to our house.” [laughs] 

Em: Oh, man. I– And did– Was he there? Did he, did he open the door to this? 

Christine: Uh, you know what? She opened the door. I do not think he was home. I believe he was at work. Because– 

Em: Okay, ’cause I was gonna say I know he slammed that door in their face. 

Christine: You know he– 

Em: And he ran for the hills. 

Christine: You know he was not gonna open that fucking door. But so she opens the door like totally surprised, and they tell her, “Oh, we’re investigating the incident.” And until that moment, Victoria hadn’t even considered like what could have caused the parachutes– She was just in recovery mode. She hadn’t even really thought like, “Wait, why did both my parachutes fail?” 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: So when they told her there were pieces missing from her main parachute, she was stunned, and she was like, “I don’t even know how that’s possible.” They, of course, talked to the parachute club who was like, “We were the ones that spotted this. We have no idea how this happened.” And a few days later, Victoria’s friend from the club called to inform her that they had reason to believe her parachute had been deliberately damaged, and they were going to report it to the police. 

Em: Ooh. 

Christine: And she’s just shocked. She’s like, “Why would anyone do that? Like I don’t understand why we need to get police involved. Why would anybody do that?” And when she explained this to her husband, Emile, he was like, “You know what? We should cooperate with the parachute center. Like they’re just trying to do what’s best.” So he’s just playing along. He told Victoria that– 

Em: Y-you know he’s sweating bullets. You know he’s like– 

Christine: Oh! Oh! He’s sweatin’. 

Em: He’s saying that while like picking every cuticle he’s ever had in his life. He’s– 

Christine: 100%. 

Em: Yeah. He’s like, “We s–“ 

Christine: He’s like making his fingernails bleed. 

Em: [in a forced, stressed tone] “We should listen to them.” Like he’s like– 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: You’re not hiding it. 

Christine: His hair’s just falling out in front of her very eyes and going grey. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: For sure. 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: So he, he basically plays along, cool, cool, calm, and collected and is like, “Oh, don’t worry. If they don’t find anything, then we’ll all feel reassured, and we can move on.” So he’s just banking like, “Okay, maybe they just won’t tie this to me, and we can pretend it never happened.” So when a detective arrived at their home to inform Victoria that Emile had been arrested in connection with her accident, she was flabbergasted. She asked to speak to him, but the investigators told her he was being questioned right now, and so she couldn’t speak to him. So she called her father and went to the police station, and she insisted on speaking to her husband with no success. So he was released on bail, but he was not allowed to contact Victoria in any way. And this was very, very difficult because she is still recovering from this fall like mentally, physically, every other way. And she now has these two kids that Emile was like doing a lot of the caretaking for, and now he’s gone. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: She doesn’t even know why because no one will let her talk to him. And now she has all these injuries that she’s still recovering from, you know, even trying to learn how to walk again, and she suddenly has two small kids that she has to take care of solo. So– 

Em: I mean, I, I can’t imagine her, um, blood pressure. 

Christine: Mm. 

Em: Uh, also like I ca– Like the fact that you’re in this much pain; you’re now a single parent while in this much pain– 

Christine: Mm-hmm. 

Em: –you have no, no support; uh, and now you have to deal with a potential like criminal case against the person that you love despite the fact that they’re also incredibly abusive? 

Christine: Yes. 

Em: Like there’s, there’s no– There’s, there’s no corner of your life that isn’t at a 10 out of 10 on the stress level currently. 

Christine: 100– 100% agree. It’s like there’s no safe relaxing space for you anywhere. And like she would ask like, “Why have you arrested him? Why can’t I talk to him?” And they were like, “None of your business.” 

Em: [shocked] Uh! 

Christine: So it’s sort, so it’s sort of like she doesn’t even fucking know. Like she doesn’t know what’s going on. And so they asked her about the kids. They said– The police tell her there’s nothing they can do to assist with childcare, so good luck. Uh, and the following months basically became a never-ending nightmare as she tried to (a) come to grips with the idea that the police think her husband tried to murder her, but she’s like very conflicted about that; then like dealing with the two kids; then recovering from this like very traumatic event and all the physical stuff that happened because of it. And so during this time, she has her friends that she’s able to at least lean on and family. And her friends and family kind of have like a come-to-Jesus talk with her where they say, “Listen. This guy– He’s a known liar. He’s been unfaithful. He’s constantly in debt. He’s not a good partner to you.” And Victoria did accept those things. She was like, “You’re right. Like factually, this is not a great guy or great relationship.” But she’s like, “Just because I have a bad husband doesn’t mean he tried to murder me.” I think she was just like so afraid to even go there like mentally– 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: –that sh– 

Em: I mean, especially if you’re already at a 10 out of 10 on the stress level. 

Christine: Yeah. Right. 

Em: Like imagine having to accept the fact that your husband tried to kill you. 

Christine: Right. Right. 

Em: –Like– That– You’re, you’re already, uh, firing off on all cy– 

Christine: Overloaded. Yes. 

Em: Like yeah. You’re running on steam already. 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: Like that’s off the rails shit. 

Christine: You’re like, “Please don’t make this part of the conversation.” 

Em: And also like I feel like at this point like she probably also– I’m glad that her friends are finally saying like, “Wake up, girl. Like he’s a mess.” 

Christine: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. 

Em: But also I’m sure the last thing she wants to do is accept any of that right n– Like she’s probably– “I just wanna get better. Like I just don’t even wanna fucking deal with this.” Like– 

Christine: “I just wanna get through these months of like grueling solo parenting.” 

Em: –my broken back and pelvis. 

Christine: Everything hurts. Yeah, yeah. Um, and she was in a bad place mentally before the accident, so it’s not even like, “Oh, I want to get back to that place.” It’s like, “I’m already–“ 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: “I was already in a shitty feeling and shitty place after– like postpartum.” And now it’s like just on top of everything else. 

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Christine: So Emile was staying in military accommodations pending the investigation, and he wasn’t allowed to contact Victoria. So detectives visited Victoria to tell her they had gone to Emile’s room, and they were like, “Uh, we feel like should tell you there’s not a s–“ [laughs] And honesty, if he wasn’t the killer, this would be just like so fucking rude. But they say, “Oh, weird. We didn’t see a single picture of you in his whole room.” [laughs] 

Em: You know what’s so like toxic about me is that would be the thing that hurt me the most. [laughs] That would– 

Christine: I know. I know it would. I know it would. Which is why it feels so fucked up, but like in the context it’s like the smallest thing. But it feels so hurtful. And– 

Em: It feels so intimately painful. Yeah. 

Christine: Intimately painful. And there wasn’t a sign of Victoria or their kids anywhere in the room. And all they did see– Oh, there were photos though. Don’t worry. There were photos of Emile’s girlfriend. 

Em: [sighs] 

Christine: Uh, she was an Austrian woman named Stefanie Goller. And Emile and Stefanie had been dating for a while. Uh, he– Remember how he’d been going on all those business trips? Well, obviously they were just vacations that he took to see her. They were planning a life together once Emile left Victoria, so, um– 

Em: Mm-hmm. Ding ding ding. 

Christine: –she was just like waiting for that to end. So, heartbroken and outraged, Victoria agreed to answer some questions about Emile finally. She’s like, “Alright, I’ll break my silence if you have questions.” So they asked if he had private access to her parachute at any time, and Victoria said, “Well, he did take it to the bathroom with him with our daughter the day before the jump because they– She had to use the bathroom. He carried it in with him.” Detectives asked if anything strange had happened in the days before the jump, and Victoria said, “Well, there was that gas leak in the kitchen.” And do you remember the gas leak I told you about? Uh, I, I, I feel like I told you about it way early. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: Um, but essentially, he had call– [scoffs] She woke up and smelled gas and freaked out, called him, and he said, “Well, why don’t you turn the stove on and see?” 

Em: Oh! I don’t– I totally forgot about that. 

Christine: Maybe I didn’t mention it. But either way, she basically said to the, the, uh, investigators– They were like, “Anything else suspicious?” She’s like, “Well, there was that gas leak.” And they were like, “Sorry. Pardon?” 

Em: He’s like not even trying to hi– Like– [sighs] 

Christine: It’s so dumb. 

Em: How did nobody cal– Like if s– if I smelled gas right now and Allison went, “Why don’t you turn the stove on?”, I’d go, “You’re an asshole. That’s the stupidest joke.” Like that’s like– I would– 

Christine: Like it’s not funny. Right. 

Em: It wouldn’t even occur to me that like– I would immediately think either you’re telling me a joke, you’re an idiot, or you’re a killer. It’s one of the three. 

Christine: Or, or you’re trying to hurt me? Yeah, it’s like what else could that mean? 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Yeah, so basically he, he– Essentially what had happened – just a little SparkNotes – she had smelled gas in the house. She called him. He’s like, “Oh, I’m sure it’s nothing. Turn on the stove to see what happens.” Like basically go explode yourself. Turns out he had left all the– Someone had like cut the, uh, cut some s– They could see it’d been tampered with. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: Like somebody had tampered with the, the gas piping. Um, and so she told the police about that. So I’m sure that, you know, pinged on their radar. And the investigation they did was very thorough. They searched every inch of the Cilliers’ home. That’s their, uh, last name. Victoria felt that she was being constantly violated, especially because she wasn’t getting any answers. She was just like in pain and having to do all the work and not knowing what was going on. And she’s at the center of this, so I imagine it was very frustrating. Um, and she felt like she had no control over anything that was happening: her life, her family, like this case, her body. And finally, Emile was charged with two counts of attempted murder, once for each skydiving incident and once for the gas leak. 

Em: Oh, hell yeah! Okay. 

Christine: So that’s pretty– 

Em: I did not s– I thought he was gonna get away with that one. 

Christine: No, no. He, he definitely– I, I kind of love that they charge him for both, even though the gas leak hadn’t even been re– 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: –on the radar before. 

Em: And extra twist of the, the– 

Christine: It is. 

Em: –the warranted knife. 

Christine: Yes, yes, yes. So finally, he was, uh, he was charged with these two counts of attempted murder. Investigators had actually discovered the tool Emile had used to loosen that stove pipe where the gas had been leaking, and so they knew it was him. Like they were like, “We don’t have doubt anymore. We have the pipe that he used.” He was also charged with reckless endangerment because his toddler and infant children were in the house when he caused this gas leak. So essentially, he was planning for all of them to just die. 

Em: Triple homicide or something, yeah. 

Christine: Yeah, he was just– Or he just didn’t care, you know. 

Em: Wow. 

Christine: He just wanted them out, or wanted, wanted her out, out of the picture no matter what. So if Victoria had checked to see whether the stove was working, which is what he had suggested to her over the phone, probably she and both of their kids would have been killed. 

Em: That’s, I mean, insane. 

Christine: And that was his plan, so like– Sick. 

Em: Can you imagine, by the way, like tr-trying to kill someone by just offering that they light themselves–? 

Christine: A suggestion to kill themselve– Right. 

Em: And th– and then it doesn’t go well. He’s somehow stunned that they’re still alive, then does the pa– the parachute thing where he’s like, “Guaranteed they’ll die,” and then she’s still alive. You know he’s probably like, “What in the fuck do I have to do?” 

Christine: “What kind of zombie is– did I marry?” Yeah. 

Em: I’m honestly surprised he didn’t do something as obvious as like just fucking hit her with his car. Like– 

Christine: No, literally this feels like an ACME– like an ACME anvil should come from the sky and fall on her. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: You know? Like it’s like– 

Em: I mean– 

Christine: –what else could you do? 

Em: I gotta give it to him. Nothing should be as guaranteed as falling from a skydiving accident. 

Christine: 4,000 feet out of the sky. 

Em: So I’m not surprised if he was surprised. But like– I– Like the way that he just went from suggesting she turn on a stove to a fucking parachute accident? Like he really– 

Christine: To like why don’t you just fall out of the sky? 

Em: He wanted her gone so– however it– however immediately he could make it happen. 

Christine: Yeah, he just wanted however he could make it happen. And– 

Em: That’s so just twisted. 

Christine: –when it didn’t, he was just embittered and resentful toward her, which is like so fucking twisted, you know. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Um, at this point though, Victoria still struggled to believe Emile could be capable of something so horrible as risking his own children’s lives and like not caring if his own kids died. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: She’s like, “I’m one thing, but like these are our children. And he just doesn’t care if they’re collateral damage?” And– 

Em: I hope that woke her up of like, “Oh, he wants his own kids dead.” Like– 

Christine: I think that– Yeah, I think that was the point where she was like, “Well, this is a turning point. Like how could I– How could this– I can’t like let this slip past,” you know? 

Em: Or it’s like, I, I– “Maybe I don’t know how to totally be there for myself all the time, but I can definitely like be a protective mom,” you know. 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: Or something like that. 

Christine: Like at least– Like that’s– I mean, not to say a step too far, like obviously, but I think maybe in her mind it was like a different, a different fear, you know. Um– 

Em: Yeah, that makes sense. 

Christine: So when Victoria took the stand to testify at Emile’s trial, the defense team asked her whether she believed Emile was capable of killing her. And she trusted the justice system to make an impartial decision regardless of her own opinion, so she answered honestly. She said she believed Emile was a wonderful father. She said he would not hurt her even if he wanted to because he wouldn’t do anything that would hurt their children, like depriving them of a mother. 

Em: Oh. 

Christine: And– 

Em: Hm. Okay. 

Christine: –the prosecution was floored. They were like, “Shit.” Like I don’t think– 

Em: “We were really hoping, hoping you’d come through here on this.” [laughs] 

Christine: Yeah, “We were hoping you’d see the big picture and like be honest about it.” But she basically didn’t understand like how damning that testimony would be for their case. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: Um, and she also admitted, admitted during examination by the defense that she exaggerated how long Emile was in the bathroom with her parachute. So they were like, “Wasn’t he in there for, you know, five to seven minutes,” or whatever it was? She’s like, “No, I was exaggerating when they first asked.” 

Em: So was she– 

Christine: So she’s like going back on, on a lot of stuff. 

Em: Yeah. Did he threaten her or something? Is that what they’re worried of? 

Christine: No, I think she just was still at that point where she was like, “I just can’t believe my husband would want to hurt me and my children. Like I just can’t wrap my mind around it.” 

Em: Yeah, she’s just in denial? 

Christine: I think in denial, yeah. Exactly. 

Em: Hm. 

Christine: So she had just found out about, uh, her– his plans to leave her for his Austrian girlfriend, and she was very angry at him. Um, but in reality– 

Em: [laughs] Why? 

Christine: [laughs] I know. Why? But in reality, when it came to like the bathroom thing, she wasn’t even really sure how long he had been in the bathroom because it was just such a blip in her memory. 

Em: Sure. 

Christine: Um, so based on a video demonstration created by the defense which demonstrated how quickly somebody could tamper with a parachute in that particular bathroom, it seemed that Emile actually could have done it even in the very short time period she was now saying on the stand. 

Em: Okay. 

Christine: So even though she said, “Oh, it was much shorter,” the defense was still like, “Well, we can, we can still, uh, we can still– It s– It still can be done in that time period.” 

Em: Gotcha. 

Christine: Victoria’s heartfelt endorsement of Emile as a father, however, as we can probably guess, split the jury, because the jury was like, “Well, she would know, right? Like if, if this man were trying to kill her, you know.” 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: They, they wanted to believe her, and so it, it was a mistrial because the jury was split. 

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Christine: So the prosecution began to build a case for a retrial, and they were like, “Okay, this time we cannot rely on Victoria’s testimony. We thought she was gonna like bring it home, but no, uh, she kind of stood to his defense.” So they were like, “We gotta prove him guilty without Vi– without relying on Victoria’s, uh, testimony.” 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: That would mean proving that Emile was not the man Victoria thought he was, much less the one he pretended to be. So what they did is the prosecution printed out tens of thousands of text messages between Emile and the women he was seeing outside the marriage. 

Em: Love that. 

Christine: Because he had had so many conversations with different women, including his ex-wife, Carly, who had met Victoria. And Victoria really liked and respected Carly. Turns out while Victoria was pregnant, they were sleeping together. 

Em: This girl can’t catch a goddamn break. 

Christine: It’s just like she cannot catch a break. Even the woman of his exes that she really liked and felt she could trust ended up being a-another woman outside the marriage. So Emile fell into tens of thousands of dollars in debt. Much of his money went to hiring sex workers. He arranged sex with a woman over text while he was on his way to the ICU to see Victoria. Fun fact– 

Em: [sighs] What a fun fact. 

Christine: –on the way there was planning a rendezvous with a sex worker. 

Em: Beautiful fun fact. Okay. 

Christine: While Victoria was pregnant, he was texting Carly to plan where they would have sex. Uh, he frequented sex clubs, but his behavior was unwelcome. In other words, he w– started to become banned from sex clubs. 

Em: Phoo! Is he okay? Like what the fuck is he– 

Christine: Like no! 

Em: I mean, obviously no, but like what is he– What happened? Like what happened? I– What– 

Christine: I think– 

Em: What’s the patholo– What’s, what’s the history of this person? 

Christine: I think he’s just– 

Em: T– Wires are not wiring. 

Christine: –a sociopath, psychopa– I think he’s a psychopath is what I think. But– Wires are not wiring. Um, yeah, I don’t know. I don’t know. Um, so apparently at one sex club, he was so aggressive, and he made a woman cry. 

Em: [gasps] 

Christine: And they were like, “Get out!” 

Em: Well, good. 

Christine: Like, “You can’t be here.” So all along, Victoria continually gave money to Emile to help him with his debt. When she asked him about finances, he would be so defensive that like sh– It would be– Like we talked about last time, it would be turned on its head so that suddenly she was apologizing. ’Cause like she brought up the wrong subject, and then he flew off the handle. And now it’s like, “Oh, now I’m at fault, and I’m sorry for making you so mad.” You know, that twisted abusive thing people do. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: Finally, perhaps the most damaging communication between Emile and his many affairs was a text he sent to his girlfriend in January of that year which read, “From April onwards, I can do random and spontaneous.” So was basically saying, “Once April comes around, I’ll be free as a bird.” 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: And he then told her he would do anything to be with her, suggesting in the text some scheme in April that would come to fruition that would give Emile the freedom to move or do whatever he pleased. 

Em: Wow. 

Christine: And both attempted murders occurred at the beginning of April, so he couldn’t even wait until like mid-April. 

Em: Ooh… Wow. 

Christine: He was like, “April’s here. Let’s get this handled.” 

Em: He– [chuckles] “April 1st – let’s get it cooking.” 

Christine: April 1st. 

Em: Yeah, Jesus Christ. 

Christine: In 2018, Emile Cilliers was found guilty of all three charges against him after the jury deliberated for three days. When the trial ended and Victoria could finally speak with Emile, she called him on the phone in prison. But she soon realized like pretty quickly that, even when she talked to him from this distance, he was still able to manipulate her over the phone– 

Em: [groans] Ughh. 

Christine: –with his– like with her emotions. And so she said, “You know what? I gotta just pull the plug.” So, uh, she decided to divorce him and be finished with him for good. Following the trial– 

Em: Which is– Sorry. I was gonna say that’s wild though because you would think once he was behind bars and like he– There was nothing that he had to keep quiet anymore– 

Christine: The draw was– 

Em: –you would think he would be– I feel like he would lash out and say like all the things that would end them. Like I feel like he would try to make the move to end things. 

Christine: Oh– 

Em: ’Cause He’s like, “You’re still fucking alive after all this? I, I’m already busted. Like I don’t have to be honest anymore.” 

Christine: But like that’s no– 

Em: Or “I don’t have to be sneaky anymore.” 

Christine: But that’s no use to him. Right? It’s more use to him if he has this woman that he’s like battered and abused– 

Em: Dangling, yeah. 

Christine: –dangling and also like defending him and on his side and providing him money and providing him resources. 

Em: That’s a good point. 

Christine: Like he wanted to get rid of her when he was bored of her and had a new girlfriend, but now it’s like, “Well, I guess I go back to square one.” And in the interviews with the police, he had even admitted like, “Oh, I’m having an affair actually, and I don’t want to be Vi– with Victoria anymore.” And they were like, “Does Victoria know this?” He’s like, “Not yet.” [chuckles] And it’s like– What? And so they tell Victoria, and I think he must have been so good at lying too that she was like, “Wait, what?” Like she was like, “I didn’t know that.” 

Em: Yeah, I wonder if it was like a combination of him being charming to her or if it was like he– ’Cause there’s no way he didn’t think she’d find out about those things. Like he must have really believed in his ability to lie to her, or like he must have really thought she was just like so emotionally weak that he could get away with it and she could know and– 

Christine: Well, I think– And then he was gonna kill her. 

Em: I don’t know. 

Christine: So it didn’t matter anymore. 

Em: Oh, that’s– Okay, that too. Yeah. 

Christine: Right? It’s like once she’s dead, it’s like who cares anymore? I can just– 

Em: Great point. 

Christine: –get rid of the kids and move to Austria. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: Yeah, so following the trial and sentencing, Victoria spoke in news segments and talk shows about her experience of like first, the abuse, uh, from Emile, and then the accident. Many media outlets credited Victoria’s survival solely to luck because the airfield where she crash-landed had been freshly plowed, so it was kind of like a softer, more forgiving surface that she landed on. But in reality, it was a combination of luck and skill, which I think we all guessed, because Victoria was able to like keep her cool as the parachute failed. Um, she used her experience as a parachute instructor to do whatever she could to properly deploy the reserve parachute, and, you know, when that didn’t work, she did whatever she could to control like how she fell, where she landed, etc. There wasn’t much she could do, but she kept a cool head during that, and they think that also contributed to her survival. In an interview, Victoria said that it happened so fast she didn’t even have time to think that she was about to die. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: She was just in kind of like problem solve mode, and her only focus was just correcting the parachute. She’s since written a memoir on her experience, and she went skydiving one more time. 

Em: That’s right, girl! Good job. 

Christine: I knew people would be wondering ’cause I was wondering. And she said she just wanted to do one more jump where she was in control. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: It went well. All her friends were there to support her. Just like a very full circle, you know. 

Em: And also just like to get over your fucking fear that he now created– 

Christine: Yes. 

Em: –and like– I mean, the, the l-levels of fuckery it is to– It, it was her only super intense pa– or one of her only super intense passions– 

Christine: Her– 

Em: –and now you’ve ruined that for her ’cause now it has a bad memory. 

Christine: Correct. 

Em: So like to– 

Christine: Correct. 

Em: Yeah, for her to reclaim it– 

Christine: To use that against her and then ruin it– Yeah, reclaim it! Yes. That’s exactly the word. And Victoria said, in that vein, that she didn’t want her parachuting career to end on such a tragic note. So this time, when she jumped out of the plan for a tandem dive strapped to her friend, so she– 

Em: Good. 

Christine: –felt safe like s– 

Em: “If I’m going, you’re going, girl.” [laughs] 

Christine: Exactly. Like, “We’re both on the line now.” 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Strapped to her friend as she skydived out of the plane, she felt pure joy and freedom. 

Em: Good. 

Christine: And that is the story of Victoria Cill– Cilliers. What a fucking– 

Em: Journey. 

Christine: –roller coaster journey. 

Em: Is, is she– She’s like alive and li– 

Christine: Mm-hmm. 

Em: Is sh– She’s still skydiving? We just don’t have any record of it? 

Christine: No, I think that was just the one. She was like, “I just wanna do one more so that my career didn’t end on like such a low note”– 

Em: Gotcha. 

Christine: –so that it almost just like– like you said, reclaimed it. 

Em: Man, I– 

Christine: And then she can, you know, move on. 

Em: I wish she became like an Olympian skydiver or some shit where she was like, “And another thing! Fuck you!” 

Christine: [laughs] I think she already was an Olympian skydiver, you know. 

[laughs] 

Em: Wow. 

Christine: But yeah, she has quite a few, um, articles and pieces about her that are pretty interesting. Uh, and, and there’s– I think she’s on an episode of I Survived…, but I’m not, I’m not 100% sure about that, but– 

Em: Wow. 

Christine: Yeah. [sighs] 

Em: I mean, she deserves it for sure. 

Christine: Right, right. So. 

Em: Oy. Well, I’m glad that it’s o– I’m glad that it’s over in the sense of like I’ve been waiting several weeks to hear the end of that story, so– 

Christine: I know. I know. And it, it ended on at least like somewhat of a, a positive note, you know. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Like a silver lining out of all of that bullshit. 

Em: Yeah. [sighs] Oh, Christine. Well, are you doing another two-parter to torture us next week? 

Christine: I really don’t think so. Um. 

Em: [laughs] I feel like, uh– 

Christine: I told, uh– So Saoirse was like, “I’m so sorry about the two-parter.” I’m like, “I kind of love them because they’re so in depth.” 

Em: I think people like the two-parters, but wow, talk about a, a real, um, tease to put Halloween in the middle of the episodes. 

Christine: [laughs] No, I know, and that– You know, to be quite honest with you, if I had had any better grasp of timing and the calendar, I would not have done that, but– 

Em: Well, you know what it was? 

Christine: –was not thinking ahead. 

Em: It was a trick, instead of a treat. 

Christine: It was, and I’m sorry about that. I usually only try to provide treats. Um. 

Em: Next year, I’ll be the trick and you be the treat. 

Christine: Oh, I can only imagine what that might look like. I can’t wait. 

Em: I mean, well, I, I assume doing a two-parter and making Halloween in the middle. I don’t know. 

Christine: [laughs] Oh, just doing what I did. Yeah. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: I can’t wait. 

Em: Uh, we are about to finish up our tour. We’ve got three legs left– two legs left. And– 

Christine: I know. It feels crazy. I’m like looking now. A couple– 

Em: By the, by the time this comes out, I think we have two legs left, so we’re almost done with our, our fall tour. 

Christine: Wow. 

Em: And, uh, hopefully, spring is right around the corner, folks. So we’ll see. 

Christine: Spring is right around the corner? We just– We haven’t even hit Halloween yet. 

Em: We haven’t even hit the election yet. Well, when this– Maybe when this comes out, we’ll– 

Christine: Ugh. 

Em: You know, things are ahead of us. I don’t know if they’re good or bad or neutral, but things are certainly ahead. And, um– 

Christine: Wait, what episode is this, Em? 

Em: 404. 

Christine: Okay, this comes out before the election. [laughs] 

Em: Oh, thank god. Okay, we’ve got another week to panic. 

Christine: Oh my god. No, so all these poor people are like, “Wait, what? No, it hasn’t even happened yet.” Oh god. Okay. 

Em: Well, they’ll figure it out once I get to the end of the episode. 

Christine: Oops. 

Em: And they’ll hear us say it again in the next episode, so– 

Christine: Hey, by the way, go fucking vote please! By the way, since this is our last episode– 

Em: [applause] 

Christine: I don’t know why– Well, ’cause I thought this comes out after the election, but because it doesn’t, please vote. It’s, it’s, it’s– It seems confusing and overwhelming. It’s not. Just google it. There’s so many websites where you can just put in your address, put in your name. It’ll say, “Go to this place o– between these hours.” You can often vote early in a lot of states. Go fill out your thing. It’s easy. 

Em: Especially if you’re in a red state, please go get those numbers in there. Please! 

Christine: Or a swing state actually. 

Em: Swing state. 

Christine: Please, if you’re in a swing state. Because Ohio is looking rough for me. Um, I’m, I’m, I’m ten minutes away. I can’t even vote in Ohio, but my family can, and it’s, it’s huge. So please, please, please. One vote – I know it seems like nothing, but it’s, it’s, it’s a big deal, especially the youth vote. We need these young– youngins voting. 

Em: I know. 

Christine: 18 and up. [claps] Go vote! Please. 

Em: I’m really, I’m really rooting on, uh, on the Gen Zers. I’m really rooting on you guys ’cause, uh– 

Christine: Please. Please. Save us. 

Em: We’ve, we’ve been struggling without you, and now that– It’s your turn. It’s– Help– 

Christine: Now you’re grownups – please! 

Em: Remember the end of Avengers: Endgame when everyone came together, uh, and there were some newbies. 

Christine: It’s like that. 

Em: Well, now you’re the newbies. 

Christine: I know. We need you to save, save the day please. Um, so. 

Em: I– One day when we know the election results, people will be commenting in this from the future going, “Oh, if only they knew,” you know? 

Christine: Don’t say that. [laughs] 

Em: I mean, it could be the– They can mean it for either way. 

Christine: It could be. I guess so. If only they knew. 

Em: And– 

Christine: That’s– 

Em: Why– 

Christine: We– 

Em: Drink.

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