E456 Town Hall Friends and Costume Condom-gate

TOPICS: SEVEN SISTERS ROAD, CHELSEA BRUCK

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Happy 456 synchronicity/angel number episode! Since it is forever spooky season in our hearts we’ve got a few more Halloween related stories today. First Em brings us to Nebraska for the terrifying Seven Sisters Road and it’s haunted hijinks. Then Christine covers the unfortunate murder of Chelsea Bruck which leaves us saying words we’ve never said before. And if you’ve got questions that no one’s ever asked before, don’t fret because Detective Schiefer is on the case! …and that’s why we drink!

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Transcript

[intro music]

Christine: Hello, everyone. Uh, welcome to And That’s Why We Drink. It is a gloomy day out here in northern Kentucky. Uh, Em’s jealous, but I’m not ’cause it’s– [chuckles] 

Em: [chuckles] I’m so jealous. 

Christine: –feeling, feeling kind of depressing. But you know what? I’m smiling my way through it. 

Em: [snorts] 

Christine: [laughs] 

Em: As most people with depression do in their daily fight. 

Christine: Yeah, who, who mask on a daily basis and need to perform. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Yeah, you guys get it. Um, how are you, Em, speaking of, uh, trying to perform a, a– 

Em: I’m– 

Christine: –I don’t know, a different, uh, outlook for, for, for life on, on the pod. 

Em: I don’t know. I’m, I’m a l-little stressed. Uh, [sighs] I mean, I, I really shouldn’t– I’m just– I’m, I’m aware of how much money I’ve spent recently. Um, and I’m– 

Christine: Ooh, I’m not [laughs] aware of how much money I s– It’s not gonna be a nice feeling. 

Em: It’s, it’s, it’s a breathtaking amount. Um, it’s just the– 

Christine: [sighs] 

Em: I’ve been traveling a lot. Um, doing a lot of like– Weirdly, even though I’m on the West Coast, I’ve been doing like, quote, “day trips” places. Um, and I’m just– I’m learning a lesson that you and many before me have learned, which is the price of boarding my dog [Em’s breath stutters], my dog. I can’t even breathe. Um– 

Christine: Ohh, the dog. [laughs] You can’t even breathe. It sounded like you were gonna cry, and then you were like, “No, I’m actually having a heart episode.” [laughs] 

Em: [laughs] Um, no. I, I just got my Thanksgiving tickets to Seattle like right before we started recording, and I was like, “Oh, I should look at the price for boarding.” And then I– 

Christine: Oh, Thanksgiving. Oh, right. 

Em: And you t– 

Christine: And then you have to board. Oh my god. 

Em: It was also like surge pricing. I was like, “I, I shouldn’t have done that right before I was supposed to have a good day.” So um– 

Christine: Mm-hmm. 

Em: Th-that, and then I’m thinking about like the stress of traveling with a big dog across the country for Christmas and what all that– 

Christine: Are you gonna bring him– You’re bringing him? 

Em: I think I have to. Um– 

Christine: [gasps] Yay. And also– 

Em: And it’s just everything’s just double the price now. 

Christine: –“Ah!” 

Em: Yeah. It’s just um– Yeah, the whole mental, uh, stress of like putting him under in cargo is pr– I mean, that’s like– 

Christine: Oh, no. Yeah. Don’t do that. 

Em: It’s– No, that’s the only option for him. 

Christine: I know. So don’t do that. [laughs] 

Em: [chuckles] There’s, there– It’s, it’s either that or board him for a month, which the– It’s– It– There’s no other– There’s really nothing else I can do. So that alone is stressing me the fuck out. 

Christine: Yeah. I one time saw our dog uh– whatever. Our d– Our parents put the dog in cargo, and then we went and picked it up at the other end of the trip, and it was like the most traumatizing thing as an 11-year-old. 

Em: I– 

Christine: [chuckles] I was so fucking upset, and, um, I think I’ve just probably have some, um, personal, uh, uh, wounds about that that, that– 

Em: No, that’s a fair– I mean, I have been obviously– I’ve been doing a lot of research on it, and there are– It’s– There’s a, a fair amount of people who agree with you. There are other people who work in the airlines who are like, “Oh, it’s totally fine.” I’m like, “I don’t know. I feel like you’re paid to say that.” 

Christine: I b– I dare you go down in there. Go down in there with them. Huh? 

Em: I know. I know. I wish. Do you know w– 

Christine: Not you. Not you. I mean the people who are– 

Em: [chuckles] Oh. 

Christine: Not you, not you. 

Em: I’m like, “I literally would.” [chuckles] 

Christine: Please don’t go die in the cargo. I don’t want anyone to die in the cargo. I just mean like, “Oh, yeah? It’s so nice down there, you guys?” 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: “Then you go down there, everybody.” 

Em: I, I do think it’s curious. I am finding very few videos of anyone giving me a tour of what it looks like down there. Um, and I’m sure it’s because– 

Christine: [laughs] You mean a dog didn’t wear a GoPro and do like a little tour? 

Em: [laughs] You would think someone would be like, “To ease your, your stress, this is what it looks like down there. This is the situation that they’re set up in.” And I’m like the fact that I can’t find that– I’m sure it’s like there’s both– there’s reasons on both sides, but I’m like I would like to know what’s happening here. But there’s– He’s too big, and he’s too um– he’s too hyperactive. He’s not– He doesn’t understand. If he sees people, he assumes he’s at a dog park. He’ll just be lunging on everyone. 

Christine: Oh. 

Em: There’s no calmly sitting for six hours. 

Christine: Yeah. Well, and you’re not really supposed to put them under or give them any sedatives– 

Em: Right. 

Christine: –because they’re supposed to be able to keep their balance. I don’t know. It just seems like traumatizing. 

Em: I agree. Although I will say, h– I have tested his trazodone, and he is very good on it. Um, but so that will be– 

Christine: You just like push him– 

Em: That’ll be– 

Christine: –over like, “Hey, pretend we’re on an airplane.” [laughs] 

Em: [laughs] I did– 

Christine: “Prove you can stand up.” 

Em: Well, yesterday I took him– I gave him a lot of trazodone and, uh, took him to the vet ’cause he had to get his vaccines. And, um, he had to sit in the front seat. There was a lot of stuff in the back seat, and he did balance all the way there. So I was like, “Okay, great. Let’s keep moving.” 

Christine: [laughs] Okay. Well, I don’t know, man. If you do that, you better put him undercover and get like at least like a tell-all of what goes down– on down there: if he sees any other dogs– 

Em: I– 

Christine: –if there’s any– [laughs] He can GoPro it. 

Em: If there’s, if there’s a way to be that way about it, I would love to. I, I don’t know. I really– I– I’m telling you– 

Christine: What does, what does AP say? What does Al Pal say? Does she say drive him across the country? ’Cause that’s what I would do, like a nut job. 

Em: No, my mom suggested that. Um, I don’t want to do that. Um, I mean, I could, I guess, but that– I don’t know. I honestly haven’t figured it out because that is something I’ve considered, but that’s just as expensive but eight times as long. Um, I don’t know. I don’t know what I’m gonna do yet. So I’m, I’m stressing about it, but I am aware of the very solid reasons why it’s– people don’t like putting their dog in a cargo. I’m like not blind to that at all. 

Christine: Hm. 

Em: So anyway, I’m stressing about that. No matter which option I pick, it will be expensive. Um, it– I do think it wouldn’t be the worst idea to do a road trip with him and then like just like record along the way [chuckles] in, in a hotel. 

Christine: Yeah, in the ho– 

Em: But um– 

Christine: –in the pet friendly hotel. That’s what we did. We found all these random-ass pet-friendly hotels. That was also during COVID, so we didn’t have many options, but– 

Em: Right, right. Yeah, I don’t know what I’m gonna do, um, but it is stressful. This is one of those things where like you just gotta figure it out. So, um, I don’t know. I don’t know. I don’t know. The end. That’s why I’m stressed this week. 

Christine: I get it, man. Uh, pets are very uh– They’re emotional labor and physical labor, financial labor. Yeah, it’s a lot. Um, but– 

Em: Yeah, and I know you’ve been through this forever, but I’m finally catching up with understanding. [chuckles] 

Christine: Listen, a lot of people are also going through it for the first time and/or are like, “Okay, got it. Maybe I won’t get involved with the dog that I saw on Instagram,” you know. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: So maybe it’s for a good cause, you know? Maybe someone out there will be like, “Mm, maybe not for me.” 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: I don’t know. Um, but– 

Em: Why do you drink? 

Christine: Why do I drink? Um, ’cause I don’t– Why do I drink? I don’t know. [laughs] I had a good reason. I think it’s just because, uh, I had prepared this episode as Halloween. Like remember in my head, I was all confused. 

Em: Yes, well that’s why I kept this up just in case you wanted to have a Halloween moment. [gestures to their background which is still decorated with caution tape, spiderwebs, and spooky lighting] 

Christine: Oh, thank you. So I do have a Halloween moment this week that I like somehow skipped. I– It’s just stupid. Anyway, so my story is a Halloween story this week. So, uh, we’re getting a little extra Halloween, even though this comes out on November 2. And I’m gonna be Grumpy Toad tomorrow, and I went to Old Navy and bought a green sweatshirt, and I think I’m gonna look awesome. So that is– 

Em: You’re gonna look great. 

Christine: [laughs] That is the plan. And then Leona goes yesterday– She– This is why I drink. Yesterday, I was like, “Oh my god, this is gonna be over soon, all this like trading costumes,” and she goes, “How about next year you be Callie the Cat, I’ll be Grumpy– or Daddy be Grumpy Toad–“ or whatever the hell. I don’t even know what– 

Em: Whatever– who– the one person– 

Christine: Whoever hasn’t been– Mm-hmm. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: And she’s like, “Let’s do it again.” And she goes, “Finally, after that year, we can do something different.” 

Em: [chuckles] 

Christine: And I went, “Okay, but like–“ 

Em: She– 

Christine: And I want to encourage her not to feel like she has to do every, you know, like the whole pattern or whatever. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: And she’s like, “That’s what we’re doing.” And I was like, “Oh, okay. I’m just making sure, you know, we’re all– Whatever that– You run this ship now,” you know. 

Em: She will never do another group costume after this. She’s like, “I put my work in.” [laughs] 

Christine: Right? It’s either that, or every year she’ll be like, “Now what’s another three characters we can trade for the next third of a decade?” I don’t know, man. 

Em: You know what– 

Christine: I’m like trying not to pr– And it’s whatever I think is gonna happen, it’s usually not that that happens. It’s usually the opposite. [laughs] 

Em: Well, at least, you know, she’s all about– I said it last time, but reduce, reuse, recycle. She’s um– 

Christine: We– It’s very easy. So I’ll give her that. Yeah. Very. 

Em: Saved a lot of money. Um– 

Christine: It’s like we just wear sweatpants and sweatshirts, and we’re like, “Look,” you know, and cat ears. It’s really easy. 

Em: I have something I have to tell you that I’m dreading to tell you. 

Christine: [laughs] Oo-ooh. Why am I so excited about it? I don’t know. But bring it on. 

Em: I, I forgot for a moment, and I, I, I knew peace in that moment, but now I have to unfortunately say something stomach turning. I have to– 

Christine: I knew peace for a moment? [laughs] Okay. 

Em: I have to– I’m gonna throw up. 

Christine: What? 

Em: I have to defend, I have to defend a man. Um, because– 

Christine: What does that mean? “Defend a man”? Oh, defend a man on air? Right now? 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: Or like in court? 

Em: Publicly. 

Christine: Oh, okay. 

Em: Publicly. 

Christine: Okay, okay. 

Em: So. 

Christine: I’m getting settled in. I don’t know what’s happening. 

Em: I’m so embarrassed. I like can’t believe that this is real. I– 

Christine: What? What happened? 

Em: So [sighs] the condom costume, as we all know– 

Christine: [gasps] 

Em: We have Me-Megan, our lovely social media manager, who was like, “Oh, I would, I would love to get screenshots of the purchases.” 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: And then I remember you saying, “Oh, well, you should do a TikTok with these.” 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: And so I sent one to Megan that said like, “Item found of Frankenstein.” 

Christine: Mm-hmm. 

Em: So that way, you know, we could use that of like “this is what I was supposed to get and this is what I got.” 

Christine: Right, right, right. Like expectation versus reality. 

Em: So you said, “Let’s do a, a TikTok about it– or I should do a TikTok about it.” And so I went, “Great, I’m gonna go get all the screenshots.” And so I w– [chuckles] I went to go get the screenshot. And moments before, by the way, I had sent the Frankenstein screenshot to Megan. I had– How do I put this? I bought the second– My– I went my second try of getting Frankenstein. 

Christine: [gasps] 

Em: Remember I told you I was going to re-buy it in time if I, if I had time for when people come over to get candy? 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: I was like, “I’m gonna go get the Frankenstein costume.” And I, I– Here– I don’t know how to explain this. Let me show you my phone. I don’t have my phone. Fuck. Um– 

Christine: Uh, I– Listen, I’m just along for the ride. I don’t know. 

Em: [sighs] 

Christine: I’m just picturing that condom costume, and I’m really in another world, so. 

Em: The bottom line is I went to go look for the screenshots, and I r– and I realized that the screenshot I had sent of “Frankenstein found” was of, of the second attempt where Frankenstein was found. 

Christine: Oh, like your, uh, r– like your, uh, do-over order you mean. 

Em: My do-over version. 

Christine: Oh. 

Em: And I was like, “That doesn’t look like the most recent one.” ’Cause I remember I got like– I also bought some clothes for, uh, next year’s Renaissance Fair ’cause I found Renaissance pants. 

Christine: [gasps] 

Em: So I was like, “That’s–“ 

Christine: You found Renaissance pants? [laughs] 

Em: I did. I was very excited about it. And so I was like, “This is–“ I– It said “found,” and it showed Frankenstein. I was like, “Oh, great.” And I was like, “But it doesn’t say if like it found any of the other items. Like where’s the one with the Renaissance pants?” So I went looking back, and I realized, “Oh, there was a first order.” 

Christine: Mm-hmm. 

Em: That should be the one that had Renaissance pants. And I scroll down to get the Frankenstein picture, and it said it was a condom. 

Christine: No. What? 

Em: Which, which means I, I bought– I picked it apparently. 

Christine: [laughs] What do you mean you picked it? Why? 

Em: Apparent– I, I must have been scrolling and just like tapped it, you know, like– 

Christine: Maybe you thought it was a bag of… chips. 

Em: I would’ve– 

Christine: Everybody else thought it was. 

Em: I would’ve never picked it. And obvious– Anyway, I have to defend this man ’cause I gave him so much shit last week. He– 

Christine: Oh, we were very rude to that man. 

Em: I can’t believe– I unfortunately have to say I picked it apparently. My stupid finger. Anyway– 

Christine: So you’re the problem. You’re the one getting the Trojan– What was it called? The XXXL, uh– 

Em: I don’t– It was– 

Christine: [laughs] 

Em: I– It was– It’s like– 

Christine: Well, there’s plenty of video evidence of it. 

Em: I’m h-having flashbacks here. I, I– 

Christine: Wait, did the guy like message you and say like, “Hey, I’m not that bad of a DoorDash shopper”? Or no, you just like saw– 

Em: No, he never said anything. 

Christine: Oh, oh. 

Em: I’m just– I just– 

Christine: I was like, “Is he mad at me? I’m so scared of him.” [laughs] 

Em: No. I’m just trying to like redeem my karma here where like we ripped that man apart– 

Christine: Oh, I see. 

Em: –and I went to go make that stupid TikTok, and I couldn’t f– I was like, “Where’s the second Frankenstein costume?” I scrolled down and saw a condom. W– 

Christine: You’re like, “Here’s a screenshot of the condom– Wait a minute.” 

Em: Which mean– I, I must– I s– I don’t know how that– I, I know that on DoorDash for food, I have clicked like “bowl of soup,” and then all of a sudden, soup shows up with my order. So like– 

Christine: I literally thought you were gonna say you order condoms sometimes, and I was like, “Um, okay. TMI.” [laughs] 

Em: No. Oh my god. 

Christine: [laughs] And so you accidentally ordered condoms from the Hal– Spirit Halloween. Um– 

Em: Anyway, I will happily send you uh– For everyone to judge me, I will send a screenshot of [laughs] the actual order. 

Christine: Well, I know what I want. I want the te– 

Em: It’s Renaissance pants and a condom. 

Christine: I want testimony from the, uh, man, the DoorDasher. I want him to tell– I want him to hea– 

Em: I hope he never finds out. 

Christine: I know. I do too actually. I was gonna say that would be hilarious. Now I’m like, no, it wouldn’t. It would be [laughs] probably upsetting. Um– 

Em: And you know what? I, I– 

Christine: And he’s like, “I was like, ‘What the hell is this co–?’” Yeah. Anyway. 

Em: And to this day, I would have– I would have hated that man unless I went to go make that stupid TikTok. 

Christine: [laughs] See? Look. 

Em: I would have never known. 

Christine: Everything works out. 

Em: Anyway, I, I just I felt like I needed to give a PSA. It’s the o– I don’t know what I’m doing here. Anyway, I just felt so embarrassed that I like just ripped that person apart who– He exists somewhere, and I– 

Christine: Did you send it to Me– I wi– I hope– I wish in this world that I’ve invented in my head that you had sent that screenshot to Me– all the screenshots to Megan without even checking, and then Megan was like, “Um, quick Q for you.” [laughs] 

Em: I just– I, I truly– I just clicked the, the closest one that said “found Frankenstein.” I went, “Okay, great. That’s obviously the one.” And then I looked, and I was like, “That can’t be the right one ’cause I got something else,” and then– Anyway, I just– 

Christine: Wow. Wow. 

Em: And by the way, the second Frankenstein did show up, and it was in the wrong size. So. 

Christine: Oh, well that is unfortunate. 

Em: Anyway. 

Christine: You’re getting closer though. Sort of. Did you return the condom or was it like too late? ’Cause I know they’re really strict about that. 

Em: It was too late. It is– 

Christine: [gasps] 

Em: I don’t even– I put– I sent it to– 

Christine: And what can you do? You can’t be like, “I didn’t order this because they’ll be like, “Well, you did.” 

Em: [whispering] I brought it to Goodwill. 

Christine: Oh! [laughs] Someone will make good use out of that, I guess. 

Em: But I also brought an adult small Frankenstein costume. 

Christine: Oh, okay. So maybe it’ll be a family, you know– Whoever– They’ll just mix and match. Yeah. 

Em: Anyway, the, the condom thing was a stupid– 

Christine: [snorts] 

Em: –was a flub. It is my fault. And then the actual Frankenstein round two came. That was the wrong size. So now we’re on round three of a costume, and I got, uh, a doctor mad scientist coat, so I could just be Dr. Frankenstein. And I am dressing Hank up as actual Frankenstein. 

Christine: [gasps] Gasp. 

Em: Or Frankenstein the monster, however, you know p– 

Christine: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Frankenstein’s– Yeah, it’s– He’s your monster, so you gotta take ownership of that. Your little monster. 

Em: Anyway. 

Christine: Frankenstein’s– Hankenstein’s monster. 

Em: Anyway, I b– 

Christine: What a babe. 

Em: My apologies to everyone, but I’m glad we all got a laugh out of it. But just to know that I was sitting in that costume, and it was 100% my fault the whole time is so embarrassing. [laughs] To tha– 

Christine: It’s much actually much better for me and my mental health that it was all your fault. It makes, it makes it– 

Em: I don’t– I’m so embarrassed. Anyway, the end. That, that was my, uh, pre-Halloween. And tomorrow, you’ll be, I guess– Are y– Which one are you gonna be for Grumpy Cat? 

Christine: For Grumpy Toad? 

Em: Grumpy Toad. 

Christine: I’m, I’m Grumpy Toad from Pete the Cat, um, who is the only like non– Well, that’s not true. There’s a platypus. Thank god she didn’t get us involved in that character. Um, Grumpy Toad is like the weirdest character, and he is like– He [nasal voice] talks like this the whole time [laughs, switches back to normal voice] And he wears purple glasses, and he loves to play marbles. So I’m kind of leaning into my own like kind of uh– some of my own behavior styles, which is easy for me. But, um, you know, I’ll probably just be handing out candy and drinking with my mother. So I– It– 

Em: Perfect. 

Christine: Every time someone asks me what I am, I’ll probably just be like, “A frog.” [laughs] 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: ’Cause I don’t necessarily– Unless Leona’s there, then I have to really play the part, you know. 

Em: Sure. What– Is it, is it still– Does it still feel like Halloween to you as– now that it’s November technically? 

Christine: Oh… 

Em: Or is– are we in Thanksgiving territory? 

Christine: I think I immediately almost switch, which is silly ’cause I brought Halloween stuff today. What about you though? 

Em: Yeah, I agree. I think I– 

Christine: It– It’s like a hard switch, which is annoying ’cause I’m like. “I would like to do like the–“ But it’s same with Christmas for me. Like afterward, I’m sort of like, “Okay, next.” I don’t know. 

Em: I– Well, no, I think Christmas lingers for me because it’s like the last of them. 

Christine: Really? 

Em: And I’m like, “I gotta hold on to something magical.” Um– 

Christine: [laughs] “Hold on. Let me hold on to this real quick.” 

Em: No, October is Halloween, November is Thanksgiving, and then Christmas ’til– until like the beginning of February. Like through January, I still think of like the holidays. 

Christine: Oh, I wanna be that. Okay. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Well, I’m gonna participate that way ’cause I usually just get really depressed and then just sit in the dark for a month thinking, “I wish I had Christmas. I should have held on to Christmas.” [laughs] 

Em: [chuckles] Well, oh well. 

Christine: Next time. [singing] ♪ This year, I’ll hold on tight. ♪♪ 

Em: Oh, that’s beautiful. 

Christine: Thank you. 

Em: Well, I have, uh, a story for you today that is– 

Christine: A Halloween story? 

Em: I guess technically. I mean, they are all Halloween stories. 

Christine: They’re all kind of spooky. 

Em: Um, but sure, let’s say yes. So this is– Oh, and happy 456. 

Christine: I know. 

Em: That’s a– Feels special. 

Christine: That’s a nice– Yeah, that’s a nice little angel number for us. 

Em: Uh, this– 

Christine: Is that still an angel number or is that just like a lucky nu– Like a– 

Em: I think– 

Christine: Like a, a synchronicity type thing? 

Em: I think it’s just a p-pattern that humans seem to really enjoy. I don’t know. 

Christine: [chuckles] Well, I certainly enjoy it, so. 

Em: I enjoy it. 

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Em’s Story – Seven Sisters Road 

Em: Um, okay so this is the story of the Seven Sisters Road. And– 

Christine: Seven Sisters Road? Okay. My mom is one of seven sisters. Sorry, my phone’s buzzing. 

Em: Is she really? 

Christine: Um, sorry, I ordered a costume. No, I’m just kidding. Um– 

Em: [chuckles] Stop it. 

Christine: [laughs] 

Em: I like– I really– 

Christine: Any– I’m so sorry. 

Em: When I found out, I was like, “There’s no way I can’t tell this story.” But– 

Christine: Yeah. At a certain point, it’s like, “Well, there’s no way out of this maze. I hit a dead end.” 

Em: I’ll tell you. This is a PSA. Watch what you fucking click on by accident. 

Christine: Oh, yeah. 

Em: And also, and also where was Frankenstein? Like I couldn’t have ordered Frankenstein and that? I don’t know. 

Christine: Yeah, maybe you got them confused, which sometimes happens. 

Em: I– Maybe I clicked on it to be like, “Who would get a fucking condom cos–?” and then closed out. 

Christine: You’re like, “What is this?” Yeah. 

Em: But I accidentally– I have no idea what happened. 

Christine: You’re like, “Who would get a bag of chips as their costume?” and then– 

Em: Well, I really– [laughs] I really have like the– On DoorDash, you know how if you just like press the plus button, all of a sudden it does add to your cart instead of– You know? 

Christine: I– Yeah, I don’t know. I don’t know. 

Em: I have, I have– 

Christine: Don’t they have to make you pick a size though or something? I don’t know. I don’t order– I feel like I– 

Em: I think a con– that condom was a one size fits all since it was XXXL. 

Christine: [laughs] Actually, it wasn’t. It was actually a “fits only huge dudes.” Okay? 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: So, first of all, don’t even disrespect the costume like that. 

Em: Well, no, I have, I have like done like a CVS order, and all of a sudden, there’s just random candy in there I thought I didn’t order. 

Christine: [laughs] You’re like, “Ooh.” 

Em: And then I look back, and it’s because of the plus button. 

Christine: It’s like a Freudian slip. You’re like, “Oh, candy.” 

Em: Anyway, I just– What a stupid fucking thing that happened to me. Okay, sorry. Keep going. 

Christine: Um, no, I was just saying my mom is one of seven sisters. 

Em: That’s wild. 

Christine: Um, so I, I wonder if this is their road. 

Em: I should know this, but what number is she in the lineup? 

Christine: Two. 

Em: Oh! Fun. 

Christine: Second kid. [laughs] I think it sounds pretty rough. I was like, “You’re not the firstborn. You’re not even like one of the younger ones. You’re just kind of up there like taking–“ 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: Yeah, it’s kinda r– 

Em: You’re just a responsibility-haver. 

Christine: That’s right. Yeah, it’s, it’s rough spot. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Rough spot. 

Em: Well, everybody, so this is, um, in Nebraska. 

Christine: Mm. 

Em: It’s an hour south of Omaha. And the road is apparently also known as L Road. Um– 

Christine: Like the letter L. 

Em: The letter L, yeah. 

Christine: Hey, fun fact. One time my dad told me he had a new girlfriend, and he told my brother and me while we were watching TV. And we said– He said, “We’re gonna meet her for dinner tonight.” And I was like six or seven. And he said– We said, “What’s her name?” And he said, “Her name is Elle,” and we were like, “Like from–“ Like we thought he was joking, ’cause I thought it was like from Sesame Street like, “Oh, the letter L.” He’s like, “No, she’s real–“ Basically like, “No, she’s real. She goes to another school. Her name’s Elle.” And I was like, “Wait, what do you mean ‘Elle’? Like from Sesame Street?” Anyway, turns out it was E-L-L-E. Um, and my brain couldn’t comprehend it at six, and I literally thought her name was the letter L for a long time. So now I ask. 

Em: Uh, fair enough. Fair enough. 

Christine: Mm-hmm. 

Em: Well, the– [chuckles] This road is 22 minutes– Nope. 22 miles long. Yikes. Um, but I think there’s only one section of it that is three miles long, and uh, I th– I think like the section that we’re talking about is three miles long. Sorry. 

Christine: Okay. 

Em: And all of the road is mostly unpaved, but there are many hills in the area, and that is where– The hills will come in. Don’t worry. So in the late 18– 

Christine: [laughs] The hills are alive. 

Em: The hills are– Actually– 

Christine: [laughs] Uh-oh. 

Em: So in the late 1800s, early 1900s, there was a section that had seven major hills, and, uh, a family lived in that area. The story goes that it was a farmer, a wife, a son, and seven daughters. 

Christine: Mm. 

Em: So the legend has different version– 

Christine: Hey, that’s my mom’s family. One son, seven daughters. 

Em: Was her father a farmer? 

Christine: He was– What’s the opposite of a farmer? [laughs] 

Em: [laughs] Uh, so le– the legend has different versions, but some say that the dad was actually a s– like– 

Christine: A lamp salesman? No? 

Em: [chuckles] No. 

Christine: A lamp curator? [laughs] 

Em: He was, he was the bad guy in some stories, but in other stories, he didn’t do anything wrong– 

Christine: Oh, okay, okay. 

Em: –and it was more the son that was the bad guy. Um, but the main story is that the son was fighting with his family. Uh, and I guess it was happening a lot that year, and things– the tension was getting high in that family. Things started getting really heated in the house, and during one particularly bad fight, uh, with his parents, the sisters all took the parents’ side, and so the son stormed off and went up into the hills. 

Christine: That’s terrifying. You really don’t mess with seven sisters. I’ve seen it with my own two eyes. It’s a scary force. 

Em: I, I believe it. Just a bunch of people– 

Christine: They’re rarely on the same page, but when they are, it’s like, “Oh, fuck.” You know? 

Em: Yeah, united front. Yeah. 

Christine: You’re screwed. 

Em: So later that night, he saw his parents leave for the night. Um– 

Christine: Mm-hmm. Oh, he’s in the hills, right? Sorry, I interrupted. 

Em: He’s in the hills sulking or doing something up there and just I– 

Christine: [chuckles] He’s throwing rocks at trees for sure. 

Em: “I can’t believe they’re all so mad at me.” 

Christine: “They’re so mean to me.” 

Em: And he ends up finding out that his– Or he looks down to his house and sees his parents are leaving for the night. So, while very angry still, especially at his sisters, he goes back to the house once they’re gone, and it’s unknown if the sisters were sleeping or if they were up and at ‘em, but basically the story goes that one by one he lured or forced each of them outside. 

Christine: What the fuck? Okay, no more joking, sorry. Jeez. Oh man. 

Em: Unsure if it– It’s like– Every version was like, “We don’t know really what happened.” But basically, he was able to trick them or physically drag them each out of the house and into the hills. He brought each of them to a different hill and hanged them from a tree. 

Christine: Jesus. Wow. Okay. I mean, it sounds very folklore-y. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: Like he put all of them on a different hill. That seems a little like excessive. For what, you know? But, um, unless he’s like totally nutty, like a total premeditated serial killer type, and he’s like dreamed of doing this, but– 

Em: Right. This sounds like something– 

Christine: So specific. 

Em: It sounds like something you don’t just do– 

Christine: Right? On a whim. 

Em: –on a whim. 

Christine: [laughs] ’Cause you’re mad right now. 

Em: Yeah. So eventually– 

Christine: For seven times too. It’s like, “Yeah, okay–“ Not okay, but like, you know, you do two, it’s like, “Jesus, you’re gonna do this five more times because you’re that upset?” 

Em: And also logistically I’m like, “Would they go–“ Like wouldn’t– 

Christine: Totally. Is he going back, and then they’re like waiting for him? And they’re like, “What did you do with our other three sisters?” 

Em: Yeah. Or like wouldn’t the ones that he hasn’t gotten yet hear someone screaming? 

Christine: Right, and be fucking out of there. I don’t know. 

Em: Anyway, the story goes that one by one, he would take each of them to a different hill and hang them from a different tree. 

Christine: I just don’t want it to be true. That’s why I’m arguing with it. It’s not that– 

Em: Sure. 

Christine: It’s not that I don’t believe you or the story. I just am like, “I can’t–“ Okay. Wow. That’s a lot. It’s dark. 

Em: Well, eventually all seven are in different trees on different hills. 

Christine: Eugh. 

Em: And I saw one source say, “And their screams slowly faded.” 

Christine: What? 

Em: So fucking dark. 

Christine: It is dark. Yeesh. 

Em: Yeah. It’s unknown if the mom and dad were the first people to find their daughters, but one site called this quote, “A macabre welcome home to his parents.” 

Christine: Oh, well, okay. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: That’s beautifully written. [chuckles] 

Em: [chuckles] Yeah, thanks so much for the– 

Christine: Thank you. 

Em: –the flowers on that. 

Christine: A macabre welcome. 

Em: Um, after this event, it’s unknown what happened to the family, but when locals would drive through the area, weird things would start to happen. So their animals would act weird. This was at a time where it was a horse and a wagon instead of a car. 

Christine: Right. 

Em: So the animals were acting weird. Um, the horses refused to go into that area. Their wagons would break down, and the area was unnaturally silent. And from this point on, it became known to locals that you should try to avoid this road at all costs after dark. 

Christine: Oh god. 

Em: So since this time period, some of the hills have been taken down, but four still stand. I guess in the creation of roads and stuff like that, there’s just four left. 

Christine: Right, okay. 

Em: But the lore has carried on, and to this day, people driving on the Seven Sisters Road say that the area is very eerie and odd things happen to them at night. One local said that “the land just feels wrong.” 

Christine: Mm. 

Em: “You can’t explain it, but it’s heavy like it remembers.” 

Christine: Mm! Yuck. 

Em: I love when you go, “Mm!” 

Christine: Eugh, it makes my– It makes me cringe. My soul like cringe– starts cringing. 

Em: People have said the air feels off and that they even have to pop their ears in certain spots because it feels like the space has changed. 

Christine: Eugh. 

Em: People will see orbs, uh, glowing and odd lights flickering around them, and the wind will abruptly pick up sh– uh, pick up or shift directions. So like all– You know how in your car when there’s like a big gust of wind, you ca– 

Christine: Oh, yeah. 

Em: Even the car will feel like it moves. 

Christine: You feel it. Yeah. 

Em: Yeah. So– 

Christine: Renée used to drive a Jeep in high school. 

Em: Oh. 

Christine: Imagine the nightmare of that fucking experience – 16 years old. 

Em: I, I had a friend who drove a Jeep in high school, and I– 

Christine: And it’s always the least like responsible driver– Not that Renée– Well, you know, it’s just like a little more chaotic energy, and I’m like, “Who gave this girl a Jeep,” you know? 

Em: Oh my god. Yeah, I– 

Christine: Was your friend chaotic driver? 

Em: Yes. [laughs] 100%. 

Christine: Yeah. It always is. I don’t know what that is. It’s like, “Who gave this to you and why?” 

Em: Have you heard of the Jeep death rattle or whatever it’s called? 

Christine: Oh, yeah. Yeah. I hate that. 

Em: I never experienced that, but I don’t want to either. 

Christine: I haven’t either. Thank god, I would never have gotten in that car again. 

Em: Apparently, it’s some like glitch in Jeeps that like everyone’s aware of, and nobody’s fixing. And– 

Christine: Is it– I thought it was like when you like lean too far, no? It’s like an actual like issue with the car? I don’t really know much about it, honestly. 

Em: It– I, I think there’s like– you can set it off. 

Christine: Oh. 

Em: Like some people know exactly the right way to to set it off to show you the death rattle and– 

Christine: Eugh. 

Em: But then you’d like have to just hold on for dear life, and the thing– the– your wheel is shaking like this. It’s like so scary. 

Christine: Yeah. Thank god that wasn’t part of my experience. 

Em: Well, okay. So the wind will pick up and shift directions, and I’m assuming also just m-move your car off the road, which has to feel scary– 

Christine: Right. 

Em: –in a– especially in a haunted road at night. Um, that being said, there are a lot of times where people will experience all this and still hear no ambient sound. So it’s happening– 

Christine: Mm. 

Em: –and you can’t even hear wind. 

Christine: Mm-mmm, mm-mmm. 

Em: There’s nothing creepier to me than full silence. 

Christine: N-No. And it sounds like very alien too when you get into that. Or like– 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: –something like more than just a ghost, like either demonic or aliens, like something like unnatural– like creepy, unnatural. 

Em: So yeah, I can’t stand it. And I– By the way, there’s no mention of aliens in this, but I just feel like this is– gotta be a UFO space, right? 

Christine: Right? With all these hills. I don’t know. It seems, seems a little like it would be a match made in heaven. 

Em: Yeah. Um, yeah. Yeah. So people’s phones will also die even if they’re newly charged. 

Christine: No. See, that’s not cool. 

Em: Uh, all electronics will malfunction in different ways. 

Christine: ’Cause that means your car goes quiet too, which is creepy, ’cause if you’re playing music or– Well, I mean, I– if you have the radio on, but I imagine there’s some creepy radio thing that happens too. But if you’re like playing a podcast and it’s like your phone dies, then now you’re in silence. You can’t even like pretend. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Everything’s silent. 

Em: It’s like it wants you to think about how creepy it is. 

Christine: That’s what it feels like. 

Em: Yeah. And by the way, let’s not forget that cars these days, a lot of them are electronic. So– 

Christine: Cars these days, true. 

Em: Cars these days. 

Christine: And it is creepy when people talk about like their cars like kind of sh– the system like shutting down. 

Em: Yeah. Oh my god. 

Christine: Like my car does that if I reset the like little screen where the, um, you– when you plug your phone in and the little screen comes on. If I– Sometimes like the touch thing won’t work, so I’ll reset it, and it like goes [makes sounds of something shutting down] and like you’re driving– 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: –but like the whole car just like goes quiet, and you’re like, “Is it allowed to be moving still? Like I feel like it’s not on?” 

Em: Oh my god. 

Christine: But it just shuts down all the– It’s a creepy sound. It like [makes shut down sound again]. 

Em: Yeah, it– Like a, like a– 

Christine: I would for sure do that to you if we were on that road. 

Em: Thank you. 

Christine: I would like lean over and hold the button until it started over just to scare the shit out of you. 

Em: Hm. And what would I do? Leave you on the road and drive away. Um– 

Christine: Oh, right. Fair. Well, you’d probably jump out, and then I’d have to handle that situation, which would be a big problem. 

Em: [laughs] Uh, investigation teams have actually gone out here, and they’ve said that their electronics will also die. So their mics and their cameras will either pick up weird in-interference– 

Christine: Hm. 

Em: –um, or just die even if it’s a fresh battery pack. People have felt hands brush past them, and one person even said that they felt their sweatshirt pull itself up on them, which I hate. 

Christine: Ew, what? Yuck. 

Em: Which like that does not feel like something the sisters would do. 

Christine: Yeah, I don’t know. Right? That’s kind of like, “What are you doing?” 

Em: Um, one friend who was in that group though watched it happen and saw the, the t– the hoodie lift up by itself. 

Christine: Were they in a car or were they just like out and about? 

Em: I think they were just standing at like a gas station in the area. 

Christine: Oh, okay. Okay. ’Cause I was like, “That feels like really complicated,” but if you’re just outside– 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: Good point. Very, very fair question. Uh, drivers claim to see shadows moving outside in eerie ways. 

Christine: Mm-mmm. 

Em: Spooky. 

Christine: [chuckles] 

Em: And some have even said that these shadows have glowing red eyes. This has become like a big thing there– 

Christine: Whoa. 

Em: –where people always claim to see red glowing eyes in the hills. Um, and in 1960– This is very weird, but in 1960, there was a week where multiple people all reported to the police that there was something with red eyes glaring at them in the hills. 

Christine: Ah! In what? ‘50s or ‘60s, you said? 

Em: 1960. 

Christine: This feels very extraterrestrial to me. I don’t know. 

Em: Yeah, thank you. 

Christine: It does. You’re welcome. [laughs] 

Em: It does. And– No, ’cause you’re totally right. Like there’s electronic malfunctions. 

Christine: Right? 

Em: Uh, it just feels really eerie. It’s very silent. Uh, I mean, it j– Yeah, I, I would agree that this feels more UFO than anything. 

Christine: I agree with the thing I said. [laughs] 

Em: With exactly what you said. Um, people have also reported hearing bells ringing out in the distance. 

Christine: Huh. 

Em: And people ha– for some reason have gone to investigate, and they haven’t found anything. Um– 

Christine: Ohhh-kay. That’s, that’s probably good. 

Em: They’ve also heard voices and whispers talking to them that are just out of view every time. And investigators have looked for, um, these noises in a nearby cemetery, and apparently, um, there’s never anybody there. It’s– I’m– It sounds like it was kind of like an abandoned cemetery. Um, but they thought, “Well, maybe that’s where the bells are coming from or someone’s there seeing somebody,” and there’s never anyone. 

Christine: Mm. 

Em: Um, they’ve also picked up female EVPs of someone saying, “Help us.” 

Christine: No. 

Em: And people like– I mean, you said earlier, different parts of a car can die, and– or– in creepy situations. And I said, “Oh, well, a car is like a, a whole machine itself.” 

Christine: Right. 

Em: Cars will malfunction altogether where their speedometer needle will have a mind of its own. 

Christine: Mm-mmm. 

Em: They’re– 

Christine: And that’s like, that’s like um– feels– 

Em: Alien. 

Christine: Yeah, that feels like compass, like, uh, magnetic stuff too, you know, like magnetic interference. 

Em: Mm. 

Christine: Yuck. 

Em: Well, tell me this. Tell me if this is horrifying to you. 

Christine: Yes. 

Em: Their windows will go up and down by themselves. 

Christine: Ah! Uh-uh. Your sweatshirt’s going up, your window’s going down. 

Em: [chuckles] I mean, it’s– I– That’s– Like your window is your only safe haven when you’re tr-trapped in a car. 

Christine: I know. It feels like your only little barrier. Yeah, yeah. 

Em: Can you imagine if your car just like stopped itself on the side of the road, turned all the music off, and then the window goes down? 

Christine: [laughs] Oh no. Oh my god. Yeah. 

Em: I would absolutely lose my fucking mind. 

Christine: Nightmare. Nightmare. 

Em: A common thing that happens to people is that their car’s headlights will shut off completely, or they will dim only while in the area and as soon as you leave the area they will re-brighten. 

Christine: Ew. And then you have to drive slower, and then you get nervous you’re gonna hit something. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Like it’s just elevated your fear. I don’t know. 

Em: That’s such a good– I’m glad that you’re here. Okay. [chuckles] So– 

Christine: [laughs] Oh, good. 

Em: Another common thing is that the cars will just, um, stall out of nowhere and leave people stranded in the hills. 

Christine: Great. Fantastic. 

Em: Um, that is– We’re now teetering into like certainly one of the most– some of the most common things that happen here. The, the one of the first things that every story had was, “Oh, your car will stall. Especially if you’re at the top of a hilltop, the, the car will stall and then feel like it’s going backwards down the hill, which like you can’t do anything about.” 

Christine: Yuck. 

Em: Um, yeah, so it’ll just stall, and then if you try to turn it back on, people say that they hear someone talking to them or– 

Christine: Oh god. 

Em: So i-imagine if you’re a teenager though, and it’s like, “Go turn your car off out in the hills and see what happens,” you know, like– 

Christine: Yeah, “Count to 100.” Oh god, so spooky. 

Em: Um– Oh, that was my next bullet point. Many people have said on top of your engine stalling– Oh no, this is a new thing. [chuckles] Get ready. Okay, um– 

Christine: [chuckles] I’m ready. 

Em: [chuckles] Many people have said on top of the engine stalling, their radio will freak out. 

Christine: Mm. 

Em: And sometimes it will– Which you actually mentioned the radio. 

Christine: Mm-hmm. 

Em: Sometimes it changes from music to static. Other times it will turn off altogether. It’ll just, “boop!” It’s turned off. And other times it switches to stations playing creepy music. 

Christine: Oh, I love that. They’re like, “Let’s go set the vibe first before we attack.” [chuckles] 

Em: Yeah. One time a guy’s radio switched itself to the song, “The End” by the Doors. 

Christine: Oh, I was gonna say, “What qualifies as creepy music?” That counts, I would say. 

Em: Even scarier than the words in that song al– It’s a 12 minute song. 

Christine: Oh, well, nightmare again. 

Em: [chuckles] It’s like when they’re like, “Oh–“ 

Christine: Ding-ding-ding. 

Em: “–five minutes, but it felt like an eternity.” Imagine 12 minutes of your window going up and down, and you’re just– 

Christine: Of classic radio, and you’re like, “Help.” [laughs] 

Em: By the way, the song is about a guy wanting to kill his family. [yawns] Excuse me. 

Christine: [yawns] Now I’m yawning. We’re like, “Boring!” [laughs] 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: So sorry. 

Em: I’ll say it again. 

Christine: Sometimes I just get the uh– What do y– Contagious yawn. 

Em: The sleepies, yeah. 

Christine: The sleepies. 

Em: So keep in mind, this song is about a guy wanting to kill his family. 

Christine: Yikes. 

Em: Even– He even walks down the halls to their room and tells them he wants to do it. 

Christine: What? 

Em: Which like hello? That feels very similar to the story. 

Christine: It feels, it feels like the story is almost being set up by some other ghost that’s like, “Let’s make them believe it’s this story,” ’cause it’s like so specific. 

Em: I know. The– 

Christine: You know? 

Em: And the song, “The End,” um, that was playing. I just wanted to read some of the lyrics to you. 

Christine: Yeah, yeah. Can you sing them actually? That would be great. 

Em: I don’t know. I would try, but I don’t know the word– I don’t know the music at all. I just looked up the lyrics. 

Christine: Oh, you can make ‘em up– make it up. I don’t know it either, so I wouldn’t know. [chuckles] 

Em: [chuckles] 

Christine: Just kidding. You can just say the words. 

Em: I, I was gonna try. Uh– [laughs] 

Christine: Ah! 

Em: Well, okay. So the first line is, “This is the end, beautiful friend. Thi–“ And imagine, by the way, your car has stalled. The radio has– 

Christine: [chuckles] No. You’re on the top of a fucking dark-ass hill. 

Em: The wind is pushing you around, and yet there’s no wind. You’re seeing eyes staring at you, and your window’s going up and down. 

Christine: Mm-mmm. 

Em: “This is the end / Beautiful friend / This is the end / My only friend, the end // There’s danger on the edge of town / Ride the King’s Highway, baby // Fuck yeah, do it / Come on! Alright–” 

Christine: [gasps] 

Em: “Kill, kill, kill, kill, kill, kill // This is the end / Beautiful friend / This is the end / My only friend, the end / The end // It hurts to set you free / But you’ll never follow me / The end of laughter and soft lies–” 

Christine: [whisper screams] 

Em: “The end of nights we tried to die / This is the end” 

Christine: What the fuck, dude? What are The Doors up to? What’s happening here? 

Em: [laughs] Well, okay. So those were, those were three different lines of lyrics. 

Christine: [gasps] 

Em: So there was some stuff going on in the middle there. But yeah, isn’t that fucking crazy? 

Christine: Still like– 

Em: And imagine you hear that in the middle of nowhere. 

Christine: Yuck. Uh, yuck. I’m like looking– ’Cause you know how sometimes back then they would write words about a serial killer? 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Um, it doesn’t even seem to be that it’s about a serial killer. So that’s just great. 

Em: No, literally the song is like a, a son walking down the hall saying, “Dad, I want to kill you.” 

Christine: Forget it. 

Em: And then at the end it’s like, “Alright, kill, kill, kill, kill–” Ugh. 

Christine: Yeah. Forget it. 

Em: I can’t– I literally think I would just lie in the car, lie down and close my eyes and just embrace my fate. I’d be– I don’t even– I’m not even fighting. 

Christine: [singing] ♪ Goodbye, cruel world. ♪♪ Yeah. 

Em: [chuckles] So other than the radio freaking out, the number one most common haunting here– You got the car stalling, the radio freaking out, and the screaming. 

Christine: Ahh! 

Em: Like that. So– 

Christine: [laughs] Just like that. That is scary. 

Em: –people hear screaming of all volumes, uh, both outside and inside their car. 

Christine: Oh. 

Em: And sometimes it starts as soft voices, um, outside of the car that kind of grow and get louder and louder. Other times, people have heard screams literally from their back seat. 

Christine: Oh no. 

Em: Some people have even said that they’ve had the audacity to look in their rearview– I say, audacity– to look in the rearview mirror and see what the screaming is all about, and there are faces in their back seat. 

Christine: In the back seat? No. 

Em: In the back seat. 

Christine: No, no, no, no, no, no. 

Em: I know. I know. I know. Um, sometimes the screams happen while the car stalls and refuses to turn on. 

Christine: Mm-mmm. 

Em: There have been other people that, right when their engine lights back up, all of a sudden, there’s a scream in their ear. Um, which I know I said voices earlier, but the screams are just too much for me. 

Christine: I just like– Are– But the screaming is crazy. And I’m like, “Is it like they’re trying to use the energy of the car to like communicate? And that’s why the car is shutting off?” 

Em: Mm! 

Christine: Like why are they s– It’s like– I don’t know. It’s just weird. Like what are you doing? 

Em: Detective Schiefer is, uh, on the case. 

Christine: [laughs] Like gonna ask questions that are– have no answers. 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: We’ll never really know. 

Em: You know what? Every detective asks questions that has no answers, and then they find them. So– 

Christine: That’s so great. Thank you. 

Em: You’ll find it along the way. 

Christine: Someday. 

Em: Others say that the screaming will turn into abrupt silence out of nowhere. So screaming, silence. 

Christine: That is scary. That’s somehow cr– even creepier. 

Em: So all that to say, is, is the legend real of the seven sisters being hung from different trees on different hills? What do you think? 

Christine: I feel like– Well, my gut was like, “Oh, maybe there was a really terrible crime, and over the years, it’s been like exaggerated to like seven sisters. And maybe it wasn’t quite as many?” But I don’t know. It– I, I don’t know. What, what is– Is there a real answer? 

Em: Detective Schiefer is on it. So uh– 

Christine: Oh! [laughs] 

Em: We– You made some interesting points. So we don’t know for sure if that ever happened, but there is no evidence of a gruesome murder like that. 

Christine: [gasps] Oh. 

Em: Although, it has been suggested because it was a very small town over a hundred years ago, it might have just been kept off the record to avoid any shame. 

Christine: Right, right, right. 

Em: But whether or not that’s true, there’s no police record; there’s no county record; there’s no newspaper articles about it. 

Christine: Hm. 

Em: Um, this is most likely just a tall tale, but it could have been inspired by actual hangings in the area because this county, uh, is one of the top counties to have the most public hangings in the 1800s. 

Christine: [gasps] Oh, shit. Okay. Wow. So there’s at least some horrible things that happened here. 

Em: Yeah. So there were, uh, apparently five– is how many hangings there were in the 1800s in this county. 

Christine: Sheesh. 

Em: And one of them was in 1887 when a husband was said to have killed his own daughter for the inheritance. 

Christine: [sucks in a breath] Yuck. 

Em: So that could be where we get the story of like a family hanging. 

Christine: Right, right, right. And murder and– Yeah, yeah. 

Em: And why sometimes the dad is actually the bad guy in the story you hear. 

Christine: Right, right, right. 

Em: Um, the man also lived near what is now Seven Sisters Road where the legend happened. 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: So that would, that would fit that like a guy did live here and killed his daughter. 

Christine: For sure, for sure. 

Em: Also in the area, there was once a family who lived here that had one son and seven daughters. 

Christine: Oh? 

Em: But their death dates all differ drastically. Like they definitely didn’t experience a murder. 

Christine: Okay. 

Em: But there’s the thought that people just kind of combined the story of like a son and seven daughters and this guy who hanged his daughter in the area. 

Christine: Right. 

Em: Smashed them together– 

Christine: [gasps] 

Em: –and got this like fucked up family lore. 

Christine: And like who knows how– if the– that other family with s– with eight kids was fucked up anyway in their own way, right? And then they just got kind of like– I mean, who knows? But it just feels like an easy thing to combine. 

Em: Yeah. So, um, yeah, it just– I, I could see that in a small town becoming a very easy story. 

Christine: Yeah, yeah. 

Em: So today a lot of people have turned this into like the local challenge. Like mine is the Bunny Man Bridge. 

Christine: Right. 

Em: And it’s like, “Oh, drive through at night with your headlights off or something.” However, I did see on two different websites, I think, people posting warnings about doing this. And they did say, “If you’re gonna do this–“ This is a quote. 

Christine: Uh-huh. Okay. 

Em: “Don’t drive alone. Never stop at the top of the hill.” 

Christine: [gasps] 

Em: “Keep your lights on. Avoid the road after midnight. And if you hear screaming, don’t look back.” 

Christine: Ah! It’s so creepy. It sounds like the end of a Goosebumps book. 

Em: [chuckles] I know. 

Christine: “Don’t look back, whatever you do.” [laughs] 

Em: Anyway, so that’s the Seven Sisters Road. 

Christine: Ah! That’s so creepy. Remember when I was like, “This is just like my mom.” And then I’m like, “Okay, never mind. Thank god.” 

Em: Mm-hmm. Yeah. [chuckles] 

Christine: Um, thank God. But wow, what a tale. That did feel very Halloween-y. I’ll give that to you. 

Em: Right? Thank you. 

Christine: I was joking, but it really did. So I think we’re gonna match tones today. 

Em: Oh, good. 

Christine: Oh, good. Phew, finally! 

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Christine’s Story – Chelsea Ellen Bruck 

Christine: All right, we are back from our intermission, and it was my favorite yet. And we got some insight into, um, uh, Condom-gate– 

Em: Condom-gate. [chuckles] Yeah. 

Christine: –uh 2025. 

Em: Great way to put it. 

Christine: That sounds way worse than what it is. You know, it shouldn’t even be called Condom-gate. That feels like way more– 

Em: Let’s call it Sperm-gate, and let people join Patreon to see what we’re talking about. [laughs] 

Christine: Oh! There we go. That’s the perfect little tidbit. Okay, let’s leave it at that. Um– 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: [laughs] I mean, it’s just outrageous. I’m gonna be laughing about this for the rest of my life. Okay. [laughs] Oh god, I can’t wait till Leona’s old enough for this story. Okay. [laughs] 

Em: Maybe by then we’ll have an answer. 

Christine: I mean, maybe by then, yeah, it’ll be– We’ll have time travel, and we can actually go watch it happen in real time. That’ll be even more fun. 

Em: S– Perfect. 

Christine: [laughs] Okay, so I know I mentioned this at the start, but I, um, accidentally went Halloween-y with this one and not last week’s episode. So I apologize, but I do have a Halloween-based story because it happened at a Halloween event. So– 

Em: You know what’s great about this though is everyone’s got their candy all ready to eat while you’re telling your story, right? 

Christine: That’s right. That’s right. Um, don’t eat your kids’ candy. They know. We know. 

Em: I, I know they know. 

Christine: I counted it. Okay? 

Em: Oh, shit. 

Christine: Nice try, Mom. 

Em: [chuckles] 

Christine: Think I didn’t count my Almond Joys? 

Em: Sick. Almond Joys? 

Christine: Sick– What? Yes. 

Em: Apparently, there’s a lot of hate for Mary Janes out there, so um– 

Christine: Oh, shit. I’m like over here going, “Sure, I’ll eat it.” Like– 

Em: Whatever. More for me. 

Christine: Listen, more for you for sure. Um, unless– 

Em: Maybe that’s my old people candy. 

Christine: Oh, I love that for you. 

Em: What’s your old people can–? 

Christine: I mean, I love a Werther’s Original, so that’s always my go-to, but I get– My dad would always tell me that I’m gonna choke on it. [chuckles] 

Em: [chuckles] 

Christine: Uh, so I’m like really scared of them also. Um– 

Em: Fair enough. 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: Okay, I’m– I’ve got my, my, um, symbolic, uh– 

Christine: Halloween treats. 

Em: –my, my Mary Janes. I’m ready to– 

Christine: Oh, yes. Yes. 

Em: Ready to eat while you tell me your story. 

Christine: Oh, good. Okay, enjoy them. Uh, Chelsea Ellen Bruck is the, uh, victim unfortunately in today’s story. This is the story of how she was killed on Halloween night. So Chelsea Ellen Bruck – she was born January 1992 to Matthew and Leannda Bruck. She grew up the youngest of five kids on a farm in Maybee, Michigan. I’ve never heard of that place, but I really like it. 

Em: I love that. 

Christine: Maybee. It has two E’s. 

Em: Oh, okay. I don’t know if I love it as much anymore. 

Christine: I kind of like it more with the two E’s ’cause it’s like– 

Em: I think it’s cutesy. 

Christine: It’s a quirky version of maybe. Yeah. 

Em: Yeah. But I– Think of if it didn’t have that other E, all the ways you could put your town name into slogans. 

Christine: You’re right. But if you put your town name with an extra E, then people like get that it’s the town or– But yeah. No, I know what you mean. I know what you mean. 

Em: I mean, I guess pe– I’m sure people still do it. 

Christine: This is us at the um– [chuckles] What do you call it? The, the city– What do you call it when people go to the town s– hall or whatever? Town hall meeting? 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: Em and I are just like bickering on the microphone about whether it’s better as– with one, one E or two, and it’s like, “It already exists.” 

Em: I would protest by spray painting like one E out of every sign. 

Christine: [laughs] Just like cross it out. Um, okay. Sorry. So Maybee, Michigan, uh, very fun. That’s the end of the fun. Alright. 

Em: ‘kay. 

Christine: [chuckles] Chelsea’s father worked for the county library system and ran the family farm, and her mother worked as a bank teller. The family was very close. Chelsea enjoyed a very happy idyllic childhood alongside her sisters and brother. This town of Maybee is a town of just under 600 residents, but it’s very close-knit. Well, I guess it’s– Of course, it’s close-knit. It’s like fewer than 600 people. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: So it’s a very close-knit, uh, group. They call each other family. Um, and neighbors are often known to be very involved in each other’s lives. So if there’s an event in town, it’s pretty much guaranteed that everyone in town will assume they’re invited to the event. Like you can’t really have an event where it’s not like– Everyone in Maybee’s a maybe for the event. 

Em: I– [sighs] 

Christine: Eh, it wasn’t that good. But I tried. 

Em: No, but you know, I feel like if you’re having a party in Maybee– 

Christine: There’s something there. 

Em: –at the RSV– you– when you make an RSVP, you have to put “Maybee.” 

Christine: For su– Or a wedding invite, like it has to have something like that. 

Em: 100%. 

Christine: Yeah, yeah. 

Em: Or “Maybee you’ll come to my party.” 

Christine: I mean, it’s cute. With two E’s: “my partee.” [chuckles] 

Em: Yeah. Ooh! 

Christine: Ah! 

Em: We figured it out. 

Christine: See, now we’re friends at the, uh, town hall meeting. 

Em: Yeah. [laughs] 

Christine: [laughs] Everyone’s like, “Get these two out of here.” 

[laughs] 

Christine: “They’re so fucking annoying.” 

Em: There’s a picture of us signing the same document at the same time. [laughs] 

Christine: But we’re like trying– [laughs] Stupid. So stupid. 

Em: Okay, there’s a party. 

Christine: Alright, so there’s this big party. And every year on Halloween, this neighbor throws a party, and basically, um, it’s, it’s kind of a free-for-all. Like everybody’s sort of gonna show up, whether you like it or not. So like everybody in Maybee, Chelsea was a familiar face that everybody knew in town. Um, she was one of the Bruck girls, um, or the Bruck sisters, and she was the youngest of the girls, but she was also one of the like boldest and most well-known or most like understood or appreciated in town for, for how bubbly and outgoing she was. Very funny, that kind of thing. Um, so Chelsea hears of a big Halloween party happening in Mon-Monroe County in autumn of 2014. And they have fun things like prizes for the Best Dressed. And– 

Em: Love it. 

Christine: Yeah, got to love people who take the event seriously, the Halloween event seriously. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Um– Yeah. Well, Em has seven capes, so. We know– 

Em: I have seven capes and– 

Christine: We already know that about you. 

Em: I mean, between all the costumes I did and did not get this Halloween season, I could have really thrown together something for Best or Worst Dressed. 

Christine: Oh, you could have made at least Most Original. 

Em: Certainly most uncomfortable for everybody. 

Christine: [laughs] Most socially awkward, yeah. 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: That, that actually tracks a little bit. 

Em: “Most likely to– should stay away from your children for the night,” yeah. [chuckles] 

Christine: “To get, [chuckles] get kicked out of my party– my family event.” 

[laughs] 

Christine: Oh god, that’s good. Okay. So she hears there’s this Best Dressed, uh, award, and there’s, you know, this fun Halloween party. Um, this guy, his name is Mike Williams. He’s better known as, of course, Big Mike, ’cause which Mike Williams in, in the Midwest is not known as Big Mike? Um, and he would often throw parties at his home in Monroe County, and this one was going to be his biggest yet. Okay? It had a stage. It had fire dancers, live music, a b– 

Em: Hell yeah, brother. 

Christine: Yeah. [laughs] Hell yeah, Big Mike. 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: Uh, an enormous bonfire, food trucks, contests, prizes, and lots of drinks. 

Em: Mm. 

Christine: Um, he actually had a ten hour like, uh, schedule for the music. So he had bands performing for ten straight hours. 

Em: I need to hire Big Mike. Also like– 

Christine: [chuckles] I know. 

Em: I, I mean, I guess you can’t– You ki– If, just like how you said earlier, if 600 people live in your town and 600 people just kind of have to be invited if you’re throwing a party– 

Christine: Yep. 

Em: –you better deliver for 600 fucking people. 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: You would think by living in such a small town, parties would be a lot easier. It’s actually much harder because if everyone’s invited, you’ve gotta literally– 

Christine: [chuckles] Everyone’s like– And they’re all gonna hear about it ’cause everyone knows each other. 

Em: You’re literally throwing a town fair essentially. 

Christine: Right. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: You’re– Yeah, you’re inviting everyone to the town hall meeting. 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: Um, so– And they’re gonna show up. 

Em: Yeah, horrifying. 

Christine: ’Cause there’s, there’s an award for best, Best Costume. 

Em: And you’re competing with 600 people for Best Dressed, so you better fucking commit. 

Christine: So she was very excited about this part, and she really committed. She worked on the costume for weeks. She sewed individual fake leaves together. 

Em: Oh! 

Christine: Do you want to guess what she was dressed as? 

Em: I mean, I feel like tree is not the answer. 

Christine: [laughs] 

Em: Or leaves, hm. 

Christine: No. I like it though. 

Em: Dressed as leaves. Hm. I have no– o-other than a tree, I– I’ve magically forgotten what leaves are a part of. 

Christine: [laughs] I mean, y– 

Em: A road? 

Christine: –like what else would it be? No, it was was, uh, Poison Ivy from uh– 

Em: Oh, that’s sick. 

Christine: But like I sort of would– I would never have guessed that. Okay? I would have been like, “Oh, a shrub. I don’t know.” You know? 

Em: If she texted me and she was like, “I’m sewing all these leaves together for my costume.” 

Christine: Like– [chuckles] 

Em: I’d be like, “You’re obviously a tree. Just–“ 

Christine: “A tr– a tree. Just come on.” 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Yeah. But so apparently it was Poison Ivy– 

Em: Okay, cool. 

Christine: –um from Batman. So on October 25, Chelsea put on this like painstakingly crafted outfit. It had a red wig, this whole, whole nine yards, red shoes, and went to Big Mike’s Annual Halloween Bash. So Big Mike often threw parties, and this was, like I said, gonna be the biggest one. Um, they even had food trucks coming in, tents for people, portable toilets. He actually even hired a team to act as security and to direct parking. So this is like becoming like a fall festival situation, like an actual pumpkin patch. Like, we need to– “Everyone park near the cornfield.” 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: “And we have like ropes and stuff.” And despite his careful planning, Mike was extremely overwhelmed by the turnout. So there were nearly twice as many attendees as he expected. So people estimate that about 800 to 1,000 people came that night which is just– 

Em: That’s– 

Christine: –insane. 

Em: You know what? 

Christine: Like he was planning for a 400 person/500 person max party which is like bi– huge, and then it’s like double that, you know. 

Em: I f– 

Christine: I mean, my brain– I can’t even comprehend. 

Em: If he doesn’t leave this small-ass town and go be a party promoter, then I don’t know what he’s doing. 

Christine: Seriously. If he wants to make a– I mean, maybe this is what the Midwest needs though. Maybe he’s gonna like revolutionize, you know– 

Em: Maybe. 

Christine: It feels like this is, uh, shocking. But, but what I will say is he really didn’t feel prepared, and so he was like very, very overwhelmed. 

Em: Aw. 

Christine: He didn’t know everybody there, you know, and so he’s looking around going, “Okay, mostly I know people, and if I don’t recognize many people here, like that’s becoming a problem, like security-wise and otherwise.” 

Em: Mm-hmm. It’s giving Aaron Carter’s, uh, music video where he’s like– 

Christine: Oh my god, for real. 

Em: He’s like, “Who are you?” And it’s like, “I don’t know. I just got invited.” [laughs] 

Christine: The– Yeah, the m– uh, “You broke my mom’s vase.” Oh, I love that song. 

Em: Yeah. [laughs] 

Christine: Um, yeah, exactly. It’s like, “Uh-oh, this got out of hand,” you know? 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: And so with no more room in the field, people started parking in the street, and they were blocking the road. 

Em: Oof. 

Christine: I mean, this is just becoming a huge issue. And after midnight, Mike was fighting to control party overflow, and he was trying to get people out of the street. He was trying to keep things at least safe enough and organized as he could. People started getting into brawls. You know, there’s alcohol involved. 

Em: Oh, yeah. 

Christine: So he’s trying to get people out for– Thank god he hired security like to even– I wouldn’t have even thought of that, you know, like– 

Em: I wouldn’t’ve even thought of that. 

Christine: –as my s– in my current state. 

Em: Also I mean is– Did he really invite s– or have security? Or were they just like if you’re inviting everyone in the pa– is everyone at the party? [chuckles] 

Christine: Oh, they’re like “We’re just, we’re just guests at the party”? Um– 

Em: ’Cause in my mind, I’m like, “Are– You’re blocking the roads, but like do the cops care? ’Cause they’re also partying,” you know. [laughs] 

Christine: They’re, yeah, at the party. Yeah. I feel like there has to be somebody who doesn’t like Big Mike though. Who’s like– 

Em: Oh, yeah. Cert– 

Christine: You know, on the police who– there has– 

Em: Like the commissioner. This– The– 

Christine: Maybe not. Maybe he has no enemies. But maybe the commissioner. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: That feels right. Um, allegedly. 

Em: Allegedly. 

Christine: So most people were just having a good time drinking, dancing, socializing. Um, but he did have to get a few people kicked out for being too rowdy and fighting. Um, but of all the people there, Chelsea was among the group having a good time. She arrived around 11:00. She had an entire glass jug of wine with her, which she had labeled “poison”– 

Em: [chuckles] Atta girl. 

Christine: –to complement her costume. [chuckles] So she had this, uh, poison jar. And she was having a really good time until just before 1:00 a.m. when she unfortunately had an accident. She walked into a tent pole like that was sticking out. 

Em: Mm. 

Christine: And it was really dark at this point. Um, and they were walking from one area of the party to another, and she walked directly into, um, a pole that was jutting out, and it cut her forehead and nose, and so she started bleeding. Um, but her friend, uh, kind of like– She said– The way she described it was like, “I ‘mommed’ her for a bit and like you know–“ 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: “–comforted her, like gave her a pep talk–“ 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: “–got her a drink, and said, ‘Let’s keep going.’” So they continued on, and when Chelsea finally did decide to go home a little while later, she discovered that her ride was ready to leave, and she wasn’t like– or had already left basically. She found out that the girl she was going to go with ha-had had waited a while and then been like, “I’m gonna go home.” Um, and so Chelsea was a little bit stuck. And the worst part was that one of Chelsea’s friends who was carrying her phone and wallet, because unlike your cape, her costume didn’t have pockets. 

Em: Ugh. 

Christine: And so she had left her phone with someone else, which is like– 

Em: Oh, girl. 

Christine: You know, and it’s 2014, so it’s like at that point it’s not like you’re using it for literally everything, you know. 

Em: Right. 

Christine: So it’s kinda like you can enjoy a party without it– 

Em: Sure. 

Christine: –without feeling like you’re missing it, but still like– Safety-wise. 

Em: And her costume was made out of leaves, so like you can’t go digging for your phone every five seconds, you’re gonna break your costume. 

Christine: True, true, true. Yeah, I hadn’t even thought of that. And she already has that giant jug of wine she’s carrying around, and– 

Em: She’s busy. 

Christine: –phones were not like super convenient back then. They were just kind of clunky. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Um, so I, I didn’t find that that strange. But so she was– She didn’t have her phone on her, but her friend was carrying her phone and wallet. Um, and she found out– And I don’t want to make it sound like, “Oh, these friends left without her,” because I don’t believe that’s what happened. 

Em: No, I didn’t– 

Christine: I think it was just a big party. People got– 

Em: Yeah, I didn’t get that vibe. 

Christine: –lost track of each other. Okay, okay. 

Em: It just– People just kind of part ways at a party. 

Christine: Yeah. And they were trying to text her, right? But she doesn’t have her phone. So, it’s like, you know, she can’t even figure out– So, they just assume like, “Alright, she’ll get her way– She’ll find her way home. Um, there are plenty of people here. We know a lot of them. It’s fine.” So they leave, and, um, she’s a little bit stuck without her phone. So she asked several people for a ride home, but nobody is able to give her one. So she finally left the party around 3:00 a.m. on foot and alone. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: It’s not certain where exa– which is so sad too because it’s like you wish somebody would have spotted her or she would have thought to go to Big Mike or like the security people and said like– 

Em: Well, you would think– 

Christine: –“Can you call me a cab or something?” It’s just sad. 

Em: It’s one of those things where it’s like a catch-22 of like if there’s so many people around, you would think someone’s gonna help or notice something– 

Christine: Yeah, yeah. 

Em: –but it also means there’s a higher risk of something happening. 

Christine: Yeah, I agree. 

Em: You know? 

Christine: Like you feel safety in numbers in some way, but then if someone has bad intentions and you walk off alone, like– Yeah, it’s just too bad. It’s, it’s obviously tragic, and I can’t change it, but um– 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: –it just is a bummer. So yeah, she walks out. She doesn’t really think to um– She was pretty intoxicated, people said. Um, she didn’t think to, to talk to the security people. She left around 3:00 a.m. by herself. And– 

Em: It’s also a small town. She probably just thought like, “I know everyone. I’m gonna be fine.” 

Christine: “Someone’ll–“ Yeah. “Someone’ll–“ Yeah, exactly. Or “If I run into somebody, maybe they can walk with me,” or who knows. Yeah. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: And like if you’re really drunk at this point at 3:00 in the morning, like you’re not making the wisest decisions. 

Em: No. 

Christine: I speak fully from experience on that. Like you just think– Of course you’re safe. You’re walking along– your– the place you grew up, you know, from– home from a party. I will say people didn’t quite know where she was going because, um, it would have taken hours to walk home. So I think she just probably had got it in her head– 

Em: I think she– 

Christine: –and wandered. 

Em: I think she probably just thought, “I’ll find my friends along the way,” maybe or something or– 

Christine: Or somebody’ll pick me up, yeah. 

Em: Yeah, I mean, if, if– I’ve been to a lot of house parties where I’ve watched a lot of drunk people just kind of aimlessly wander off into the void– 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: –and they’re like, “I’ll figure it out,” [chuckles] you know? 

Christine: “I’ll find my way back.” especially– 

Em: Or she could have been walking to like fucking Waffle House. Like who knows, you know? 

Christine: Yeah, who knows? Right, exactly. True. And like she would have probably known the area. Um, but yeah, so she, she would have had to walk, uh, eight miles back to her house. 

Em: Ooh. 

Christine: So they’re not sure whether she was walking home or just like, like you said, to another location, gas station, Waffle House, who knows. 

Em: Gas station, yeah. 

Christine: Yeah. Um, so it might not have been a problem on another night that there was this distance, but this night, she was very drunk. It was 3:00 in the morning, and she had that injury on her face. 

Em: Right. 

Christine: So in the morning, Chelsea didn’t return home. Um, but her family wasn’t too worried because she had planned a friend– uh, stay the night at a friend’s house after the party. So first thing in the morning, they weren’t super worried. But after a few hours, when the afternoon rolled around, then later the evening, and she was still not answering her cell phone, that’s when her parents got worried. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: Chelsea was very close with her family, and she was the type of person who would have checked in by this point. So it was pretty worrying that nobody could get a hold of her. Um, even if she couldn’t use her phone, she would have found another way to reach out to her parents or a sibling, which is probably what she was doing on her walk home, like trying to get somewhere– or who knows. And no one who went to the party knew where she was or who she might be with. So they felt kind of stuck. Um, it was early Sunday morning when Chelsea had last been seen. So her family didn’t have all the details about how and when she left the party. Um, they just could only hope that she found somebody who would help her get home safe. But as the day passed and they didn’t hear from her, uh, they worried that she wasn’t just sleeping off a hangover and something worse had happened. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: So on Monday, October 27, Chelsea’s mom reported her daughter missing. Sheriffs went to the site of the Halloween party where Mike was still cleaning up, uh, decorations and garbage. I mean, not that far off, only a couple days. That would be exhausting. 

Em: Yeah. Yeah. 

Christine: That would be exhausting. 

Em: I can’t– I mean, y– 

Christine: You’d have to plan– You’d have to wait a whole year for sure to do another one of these big blowouts, I think. 

Em: 100%. No wonder he does it once a year. And the– 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: You do wonder like how big of a community are we? Like, uh, how big into community are we? 

Christine: Are they pitching in? 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Are they pitching in? Or do you have to hire people to clean up with you? Or do it yourself? 

Em: If s– If 1,500 people came– 

Christine: Mm-hmm. 

Em: –how many are actually here to help you pick up? 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: I think like 10. [chuckles] Like you know. 

Christine: Yeah, probably. Uh, yeah, based on– Yeah. Well, either way, he’s still cleaning up. There’s still garbage everywhere; uh, Solo cups, you can only imagine. 

Em: Hm. 

Christine: Mike didn’t know anything about Chelsea’s whereabouts. So the authorities began contacting people who had responded to the party invitation posted to Facebook to see if they had he– uh, seen her or knew of her whereabouts that night, as well as people who were posting to social media about having attended the party. But nobody they spoke to seemed to know where Chelsea could have gone when she left. 

Em: Mm. 

Christine: Because even if they wanted to help, a lot of them were drinking or doing drugs, and everyone was in costume. It’s like one of those per– And it’s outside. It’s one of those nights where you just– you know, people blur together. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: You kind of blur the, the night together. Um, and so a lot of people had trouble kind of recalling like when she left their presence– 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: –like with a group or where she went. 

Em: I’ll tell you the, the last week of my life, every time I’ve guessed the time, I was fucking wrong. Like so– 

Christine: [laughs] You were completely off? [laughs] 

Em: Like I was like, “I thought surely it’s like 11 o’clock at night,” last night, and it was 6:00. 

Christine: Whoa. 

Em: And I was like, “What’s going on?” So I imagine plus being drunk and having fun and being out all– at all hours– 

Christine: Mm-hmm. 

Em: –like someone said, “Oh, I saw her at 10:00,” and it was 2:00 in the morning, or “Oh, I saw her at–“ 

Christine: Yeah, like, “I saw her sometime around–“ And especially if you’re not like, again, on your phone every five seconds back then– 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: –like you’re not necessarily looking at the time every few minutes. 

Em: 100%. 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: Yeah. You’re just like, “Oh, I remember her over there with someone I didn’t recognize s–“ 

Christine: “Sometime–“ Yeah. 

Em: “–within a certain hour range.” 

Christine: “Like after midnight, before midnight.” Yeah. Who knows? And so– 

Em: Yeah. It’s just like horrible recall. [chuckles] 

Christine: –it’s not reliable. Yeah, it’s like not the best, most reliable type of witness to have, right? 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: Um, so Chelsea’s family organized a search party, and volunteers descended upon the fields and woods surrounding Mike’s rural farmhouse. More than 1,000 people joined the search, scouring the land near the party. They looked with dog teams, helicopters, and the Brucks, meanwhile, distributed pamphlets, thousands of them. Actually, no, hundreds of thousands of them, um, with information about Chelsea’s disappearance. Residents of Monroe County tied purple ribbons to trees and light posts, and they gave out “#FindChelseaBruck” bracelets. Rumors began swirling about what could have happened, of course, ’cause, again, we’re still in a small area, rural area, people are gonna be gossiping or worrying– 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: –or chatting about what happened. And of course, like immediately, the insane rumors start spreading. Like one was that, uh, she was burned alive at the bonfire at the party. 

Em: Yo! What? 

Christine: Like this is how these fucking stupid folklores that– not– like– 

Em: This is how the Seven Sisters Road happened. It’s like– 

Christine: The tr– Literally, like the troubling ones where it’s like they end up being really racist or whatever. It’s like this is how this shit happens. You’re like, “Oh, they burned them alive.” Like what are you talking about? 

Em: Yeah, what the fuck? 

Christine: You can’t just say shit like that. [laughs] What’s wrong with you? 

Em: I can’t– Okay. Wow. Okay. 

Christine: So like– And also why mislead an investigation so drastically, right? Like unless you had something to do with it, but like– 

Em: I don’t know. 

Christine: –why on earth would you say that when like they’re actually trying to find out what happened? That’s just tragic. So– 

Em: yeah. 

Christine: Yeah. So of course, there’s– Some people are saying, “Oh, it’s– There was a, a Satanic ritual at the party, and they burned them alive– They burned her alive in the fire,” and– 

Em: And imagine being her family who’s like– 

Christine: It’s horrible. It’s horrible. 

Em: –“I just want to know where my fucking kid is.” 

Christine: It’s horrible. And it’s like, “Back off. Like if you’re not gonna be helpful,” you know. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: And so investigators were basically like pressured into searching the ashes. 

Em: Ugh! [sighs] 

Christine: And of course, there were no human remains in any of the ashes. I think other people– 

Em: So they wasted their time. 

Christine: –would have remembered that. They wasted time and resources. Although there were no remains, of course, in the fire, Big Mike still couldn’t escape accusations in town that he was somehow involved. Um, p– 

Em: Shame. 

Christine: Um, I know it’s kind of rough. People snuck o– 

Em: Imagine just throwing a fucking– Sorry, I keep interrupting you. Like imagine– 

Christine: I know. No, no, but you’re right. You’re right. 

Em: You just threw a part– Like first of all– 

Christine: You want to do something fun for the community. 

Em: In a world of– Not to get all like on my little soap box here, but in a world of hyper-individuality being promoted on all of us, like this guy just wants a little fucking community. 

Christine: Mm-hmm. 

Em: He just wants a village. He’s throwing a party for everyone, and all of a sudden, he’s like a murder suspect. 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: It’s like, “Fuck you.” I, I wouldn’t make– I wouldn’t have the party next year. I’d be like, “This–“ 

Christine: It’s too b– It’s really too bad ’cause it’s like what a, what a beautiful thing he tried to do, and everyone was having a good time, and then someone had to go and hurt people and fuck it all up. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: Anyway, uh– Yeah, yeah. I guess with that many people, you’re bound to get some bad, bad folks in there. Um– 

Em: Sure. Sorry, I did not mean to– I’m aware I keep interrupting you. 

Christine: No, no, but you’re totally, but you’re totally right because spoiler alert, he’s not involved and so– 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: –um it is really hard to hear that like he was getting so much flack for this. People snuck onto his property with search dogs. Um, he caught strangers trying to look into his windows at night. Like people were really harassing this guy. 

Em: Mm. 

Christine: Drones over the property. He said, um, during one visit from the police, he let them inside to be cooperative, and they threw him on the ground and threatened to shoot his dog. 

Em: What the fuck? Oh my god. 

Christine: He was– 

Em: Sorry, Hank. 

Christine: [chuckles] 

Em: Dog– [chuckles] It’s like he heard that too and went, “What?” 

Christine: [chuckles] He’s like, “Uh-oh, uh-oh.” Um, yeah– 

Em: No, s– I really threw him for a loop there. That’s so fucking awful. 

Christine: Like, hello? 

Em: Oh my god. 

Christine: This guy. 

Em: Oh my god. 

Christine: So Mike said, of course he feels terrible. He’s trying to help. He wants to do what’s right, and he wants to help Chelsea’s family. He can’t imagine what they’re experiencing, but he’s like, “I’m living every day with dread in my own home, ’cause I’m terrified that someone– you know, that someone’s gonna frame me for this–“ 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: “–or put me–“ 

Em: “Or hurt me because they think I’m–“ 

Christine: “Or hurt me,” yeah. True. 

Em: “Someone could break in and try to like get vengeance on me.” 

Christine: “Or my dog, or my family.” Yeah. 

Em: “Or my dog.” Yeah. Oh my god. Oh my god. Oh my god. 

Christine: So this has just all turned into a big mess for him. Um, but meanwhile, of course, they’re not getting any closer, uh, to an actual answer. So October 29, um, they released a composite sketch of a man that witnesses believe was the last person to be seen interacting with Chelsea at the party. There was one vendor at the party– Which I was like, “Vendor?” but yeah, they were s– One of the bands brought a merch seller. And– 

Em: Fun. 

Christine: I know. I’m like, “Damn, this is quite a production.” So the vendor who was selling this merch, um, said he saw the man who left the party with Chelsea, and so he had kind of an idea in his head of what this guy looked like. They were able to make this composite sketch. Um, tips started pouring in. Investigators followed a lot of leads, but months passed with no answers. And the Brucks couldn’t really do much except wait, and they sought comfort with other families who had experienced, uh, the nightmare they were living. In fact, Chelsea’s older sister, Cassie, was best friends with Jennifer Niswender, whose own twin sister, Julia, was murdered in her college apartment two years earlier and was never caught. 

Em: Oh. 

Christine: So they are already like very close to the family who’s gone through something so scary and traumatic, and you think like, “Oh my god, imagine if that happened to me.” And it’s like, “Oh, and here it is.” Like now it’s happening to you. I mean, it’s just crazy. Chelsea’s mother said of Julia, “Our girls were so close. When Julia died, it was just a big hole blown into our lives. There has not been a day that’s gone by that I don’t miss her.” 

Em: Mm. 

Christine: And so like that was Chelsea’s mom about the daughter’s friends. So like that’s how close these two families were. And so thankfully, they were there to support each other, um, through a very specific type of grief, you know– 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: –of like the m– disappearance/murder of your child– of your daughter. Like it’s a wild thing to both have in common. Um– 

Em: [sighs] 

Christine: –but they thankfully had each other. In early 2015, a $30,000 reward was offered, (so this would be a few months after the party) was offered for information on Chelsea’s disappearance and whereabouts. And the Brucks continued to dedicate their time and resources to finding answers. Finally, in late March, there was a break in the case when two men, out looking for scrap metal at an industrial site a few miles from the party, uh, discovered a costume covered in leaves and a red wig in an abandoned building. 

Em: Oh my god. In a building? 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: Wow. 

Christine: Yeah, yeah. Creepy. And they’re– 

Em: I was gonna say originally if they’re in like a– you said a scrapyard? 

Christine: So they’re out looking for, um, abandoned scrap metal. So they’re kind of uh– 

Em: Oh, oh, oh. 

Christine: –they’re kind of wandering around this like– Yeah, I guess sort of a scrapyard, like this abandoned scrapyard type thing. 

Em: Not to like be f– I’m not trying to be funny about this at all, but she was decorated in leaves. 

Christine: Right. 

Em: So like they– I mean, that would have been a really easy– 

Christine: Doesn’t scream scrapyard. Yeah. 

Em: –way to camouflage her if they wanted. 

Christine: Yeah. Well, so they only fou– 

Em: Right? 

Christine: Yeah, they only found the costume in the warehouse. 

Em: Okay. 

Christine: So they didn’t find her actual body at this point. 

Em: Gotcha. 

Christine: Um, so I think they were less alarmed. But yeah, you’re right. Like even the costume itself feels like it would be more hidden. Like– 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: –’cause this is what broke the case open, you know, is finding the costume. 

Em: Yeah, they could have tossed it somewhere– 

Christine: Somewhere. 

Em: –and it would have looked like fucking leaves. But they s– 

Christine: Yeah, no, I agree. I think it was more just like spur of the moment drunk like not thinking, you know, not– 

Em: Gotcha. 

Christine: –a logical or premeditated thing is my guess. 

Em: Okay. 

Christine: But yeah, it’s, it’s a, it’s a good point ’cause it doesn’t feel like where you would find– especially out in like rural, you know, middle of nowhere. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: So at first neither of the men realized what they had found, and so they left it there without reporting it. But a few days later, one of them saw one of the flyers, and it said– I mean, imagine that dread like sinking feeling– 

Em: I know. 

Christine: –of seeing a poster saying like “missing,” and there’s a woman wearing that costume that you saw in the picture. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: I mean, terrifying. So he immediately reported it. This was on April 5, five months after Chelsea had vanished. And of course, immediately this costume was processed as evidence. Investigators used DNA to confirm that it did belong to Chelsea. And the lab team also found DNA on the leotard of– 

Em: Mm. 

Christine: –from an unknown male. And so that was immediately submitted to the FBI’s DNA index system, and there was unfortunately no match. Just a few weeks later, several miles from the industrial site where her costume was found, um, a man was overseeing construction on a residential lot where he was building a new house, and one of the trucks had gotten stuck while delivering dirt to the site. And the property owner was behind the truck, trying to figure out how to get the truck out of this like rut. And while he assessed the ground around the truck, he suddenly noticed human remains– 

Em: [sucks in breath] 

Christine: –which like the way that this just happens to people out of the blue is always so shocking to me. 

Em: It’s always– 

Christine: Like you’re literally on a walk with your dog, or you’re, you know, like– 

Em: It’s truly always the beginning of a Law and Order episode where it’s like just stumbling into something. And also– 

Christine: Y-yes. Or like Bones. Bones always did the most ridiculous like opening scenes where like– 

Em: [chuckles] 

Christine: –you open the closet and like– Yeah, anyway. 

Em: I just watched one last night where the guy was like digging, and he just digged up a whole body with one shovel. 

Christine: [laughs] 

Em: I was like, “How, how did you do that?” Um– 

Christine: “Please, nice try.” [chuckles] 

Em: But no, I– But– A-and also to think if it weren’t such a random happenstance like that he’s assessing the ground ’cause he got stuck there, how much longer would it have taken for her to be discovered? 

Christine: Yeah, that’s what’s so creepy is like it just seems so happenstance, you know. 

Em: Yeah. And like– 

Christine: And it makes me, it makes me wonder if the universe is like, “Oh, don’t worry. We’ll make this happen, you know.” 

Em: “We’ll figure it out.” Yeah. 

Christine: “Find a way.” Yeah. Um, so he is just trying to get this truck out of a rut, and he suddenly spots human remains, um, among some leaves and logs right, right by him. Although the remains were badly decomposed, authorities immediately suspected that they belonged to Chelsea because they really didn’t have any other missing persons in the area that would line up with this discovery. Soon after, a medical examiner used dental records to confirm that the remains did in fact belong to Chelsea. Um, on her remains, they found no DNA or any new evidence, um, in addition to what they had found on the costume. So more than a year passed, and Chelsea’s family and friends now were just hoping to someday catch her killer. You know, they got the closure, fortunately, of discovering her body, but now they wanted to know, uh, who had done this, of course. 

Em: Right. 

Christine: So residents of Monroe County, um, were also so on edge, thinking like, “Oh god, this murderer is one of us, you know. Like he must be here somewhere amongst us.” 

Em: Yeah, that’d be my first thought. I’d be like– 

Christine: Right? 

Em: If there, if there was a, a murder in Fredericksburg, I’d be like, “What the–“ 

Christine: After a party that everyone in town went to, you know? 

Em: I know. I’d be like– 

Christine: Like it’s, it’s out of a movie. 

Em: It’s out of a movie. There act– 

Christine: It’s out of a Law and Order episode. [chuckles] 

Em: I’ll tell you, I’ll tell you off air, but there actually is a from forever ago a– We might– I’ll tell you about it later. There, there is, there is like a drama like that, that happened before we ever moved there. 

Christine: [gasps] Oh, wow. Okay. Yeah. 

Em: Um, I’ll te– 

Christine: Which reminds me, you told me to look into a story, and then I wrote it down– 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: –and then I forgot the name of it, and I didn’t know how to look it up. [laughs] 

Em: It’s okay. It’s L-Lisk, the Lisk fa– 

Christine: I knew it started with L. Okay, I’ll remember that. 

Em: List with a K. 

Christine: With a– List with a K. Okay. So you know, there– The community is on edge too, like trying to imagine who this could have been, um, somebody, you know, in their own community. One resident said, “Chelsea was everyone’s sister, everyone’s daughter.” Like, you know, everyone knew her so well that it’s all so chilling to think like, “Not only is it someone in our community, but it’s someone who did this to someone else that we love in our community.” And then on July 22, 2016, which was nearly two years since Chelsea’s disappearance, police made an arrest in connection with Chelsea’s murder finally. 27-year-old Daniel Allen Clay was originally arrested two months earlier in May for larceny, and he was accused of harassing a woman and stealing her bag in that instance. 

Em: Mm. 

Christine: This also does sound very SVU. Like he’s brought in for petty larceny, and then it’s like, “Oh my gosh, you know, we’ve caught this–“ 

Em: Yeah, “We’ve connected you.” 

Christine: “We’ve connected you,” and they did. I mean, although he was promptly released in May, a Michigan state law did allow authorities to collect his DNA while in custody. And so thankfully, they did because the DNA was matched to the DNA discovered on Chelsea’s costume. 

Em: I– That’s– First of all, I’m so glad they found her killer. 

Christine: Yep. 

Em: But second of all, being– Imagine being him. 

Christine: Mm-hmm. 

Em: Like at what point do you panic that like, “They’re taking my DNA or my fingerprints,” or whatever it is, and it’s like, “Oh, I really hope they don’t connect me to this other thing. Like I hope they on–“ 

Christine: I just think people like this don’t even like– 

Em: Doesn’t even occur to them? 

Christine: Like ’cause otherwise you wouldn’t be doing shit like this. Like you don’t even have– You know what I mean? Like I feel like we can’t even comprehend it ’cause it’s like, “Well I wouldn’t–“ [chuckles] Like I wouldn’t– 

Em: Yeah. I guess so. 

Christine: I don’t– But I don’t know. Maybe– I mean, maybe– I just always think like my brain doesn’t– can’t work that way like, I don’t think, ’cause I’d be a mess. But like– 

Em: I would be a mess. 

Christine: –these people just fucking go on. Maybe it’s drugs. Maybe it’s like s– they’re sociopaths. I have no clue. But– 

Em: I would love to have that type of arrogance. Because in my mind I’d be like– 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: Even if I hadn’t done anything wrong, I was like– I’d be like, “Where is my DNA con–? Where–“ 

Christine: Mm-hmm. 

Em: “What could I have touched somewhere that now puts me in a worse situation,” [chuckles] you know? 

Christine: Yeah. But he didn’t seem to be all that fucking concerned. 

Em: Did they des– 

Christine: Um, or if he did, I don’t know if there’s anything he could do, you know, ’cause– 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: So maybe he was freaking out. But– 

Em: I wond– Yeah, I just wonder if he was sweating bullets or if he was like, “Whatever, they’re not gonna find anything. 

Christine: I watched one of the interrogations, and– Well, it was actually just one interrogation, I believe, and he confessed. But it was uh– 

Em: Hm. 

Christine: –so slimy to watch. 

Em: Really? 

Christine: It was like disgusting to watch. Really. It was like upsetting. I mean, I’ll tell you about it in a minute. I think there’s, um, some notes on it in here. 

Em: Okay. 

Christine: If I forget, let me know. But I’m pretty sure it’s in here. But he’s just a gross per– I mean, of course, he’s a gross person based on just what we know so far, but it was really unpleasant to watch him try and defend himself. 

Em: Okay. 

Christine: Um– 

Em: Good to know. Good to know. 

Christine: Yeah, yeah. Pretty gross. So in July, sheriffs went to– Oh, but imagine, sorry. Side note: you’re right, ’cause the freaking out about the DNA, but then you get sent home, and it’s like, “Okay, they have my DNA. How long am I gonna be here till they connect me?” Or two months later, “Am I off the hook? Maybe they never–“ 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: “–ran the DNA?” And it’s like, knock-knock, someone’s at the door. Um, but again, maybe he just wasn’t even thinking about it. I have no clue. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: So they go over there in July. They knock on the front door. He, of course, tries to flee, uh, and they catch him, and they arrest him for outstanding warrants. He himself, Daniel Clay, was a father who owed child support to his estranged child and the mother. And in addition to that, he was wanted for questioning because he had also been accused of the violent rape of another local woman. 

Em: Hm. 

Christine: Huh. Um, so essentially he’s a dirt bag already. So they’re arresting him on all this other shit just so they have him. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: Um, and then they start questioning him, which is what I watched. And initially they told Daniel he was only being brought in for those child support warrants. And so– to put him at ease, right? 

Em: Sure. 

Christine: And so then he starts kind of like chilling out a little bit. He thinks– He’s like– They always think they’re like bro-y with the cops, which is like just gross. And then, um, the, the investigator asks– or the detective asks, uh, you know, “Oh, what about this Halloween party? Like can you walk me through that? Like you’ve heard about this situation and stuff. Like let’s talk through that while you’re here.” And, um, oh boy, is he suddenly like sweating a little bit – but not very much. Like he definitely thinks he can pull one over on these guys. Um, so Daniel confirmed yes, he was at the party, but he said he didn’t even know who Chelsea was, uh, didn’t recognize her. The party was so crowded she wouldn’t have even made an impression. And– 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: –he said something stupid like, uh, “Oh, I only notice people if they’re sexy– I only notice women if they’re sexy.” 

Em: [scoffs] 

Christine: “I’m a little shallow like that.” And it’s like, “Okay?” 

Em: Wow, you weren’t kidding. Slime ball. 

Christine: Yeah, he’s just a gross man. Um, and so he, he– 

Em: Wow. 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: Oh my god. And then way to like kick her while she’s down. It’s like, “Oh, and also she’s ugly?” Is that what she– is that what he’s implying there? Is like– 

Christine: So no, because then he eventually walks around to um, “Oh, wait. Her? Yes, I did have sex with her.” 

Em: Ugh! 

Christine: Uh, yeah. And he says– Like watching this unravel is so pathetic ’cause he’s, he’s like, “Oh my god, I don’t even know who that is.” And then all of a sudden, he’s like, “Well, we were having sex in the back of my car.” And h– they were like, “Okay, so you just said she’s a stranger, and now all of a sudden, sh– you’re having sex with her in the back of a car.” Um– 

Em: Yeah. I’d hope you remember what she looks like. Jesus Christ. 

Christine: Well, he’s an idiot. And he said, “Oh, well, I thought she was uh– I thought this Chelsea person you’re talking about was blonde, and the person I was with had red hair.” And it’s like, it’s obviously a fucking wig, you idiot. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Like don’t pretend to me that– Come on. Whatever. 

Em: [chuckles] 

Christine: So the officers said that Chelsea was wearing a wig, and he goes, “Oh, I didn’t know that.” Okay. He said that after having sex, the woman got out of the vehicle and walked away. But then the officers were like– And he goes, “That’s the last I saw of her. The end.” You know, ’cause that’s always how they play it. Like, “Yeah, we had sex–“ 

Em: Sure. 

Christine: “–but I would never kill her.” Uh-huh. 

Em: Uh-huh. 

Christine: Um, so they keep pressing him. They’re like, “We don’t believe you.” And he changed his story again. This time he says he’s driving down the road after the party, and he sees Chelsea walking alone, so he offers her a ride. And he says she initiated sex, so he pulled over to a secluded spot. And he told the officers, “She did get pretty freaky.” And like this is again where it’s really upsetting to me ’cause I’m like, “He’s trying– He starts to try to throw her under the bus by saying like, ‘She wanted sex,’ and it’s like, ‘Hello?’” Like– 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: I– Like irrelevant to the fact that you murdered this person, it’s not– But– 

Em: Yeah, we’re not talking about that anymore. [chuckles] 

Christine: Slut shaming her right now is not– It’s just so gross. And he, he does that thing, which one of the detectives was like, “Oh, this is textbook.” Like if– once they’re framed, they start blaming the victim for– Of course, they start blaming the victim for what happened ’cause wha– There’s nowhere else to go. 

Em: Yeah, no. 

Christine: Like your DNA is on her, you know. 

Em: 100%. 

Christine: And she’s dead, so she can’t defend herself. Like how fucked up is that? So– 

Em: [sighs] 

Christine: Yeah, he tells the officers some disturbing stuff. Um, and when asked to elaborate, he said that she smacked him and bit him and that she then asked to be choked erotically. Again, is this not like such a trope from SVU– 

Em: Literally. 

Christine: –that he said he was choking her and she accidentally died? 

Em: “She actually wanted all of it–“ 

Christine: Yep. 

Em: “–and then her death was her fault because she wanted me to be that rough with her.” 

Christine: Yep, yep. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Yep. And– 

Em: I mean, that’s literally at lea– I can think of eight episodes right now. 

Christine: It’s– Ou– It’s– Every crime show has done at least three episodes about this concept. Like you– That– 

Em: Is it murder if it was consensual and then we just went a little too far with it? 

Christine: Ugh. [sighs] Yeah, no. 

Em: Yeah. Shut up. 

Christine: And it’s like if you actually hear the statist– not the statistics, like the, the, the timing on, on how long it really takes to do that to a person, especially if they’re fighting back or conscious. Like that’s bullshit. Bullshit. 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: That’s not how that works. Um, so he claims she suddenly died in front of him, and he was like, “Oh no.” And– 

Em: [scoffs] 

Christine: –he said he pulls her out of the vehicle, tries to perform CPR, okay, but she was unresponsive. And when he couldn’t find a pulse, he panicked. Being drunk and high on drugs, he didn’t even consider taking Chelsea to a hospital. He also said his phone was dead. So instead, he abandoned her in a secluded spot. 

Em: Mm. 

Christine: And he said he sat beside her body and sobbed for nearly half an hour. Then he got into his vehicle and drove away. 

Em: So let’s recap. He, he was sobbing over this person– 

Christine: Mm-hmm. 

Em: –that he didn’t actually recognize or remember at all– 

Christine: Right. 

Em: –fr– a minute ago. Okay. Got it. 

Christine: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. And now, now he’s like, “Oh, but then I accidentally cr– killed her and cried about it.” 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: “I forgot to mention that.” Like– 

Em: “So we had sex, but no, nothing like that would happen. But actually also I killed her.” 

Christine: Yeah. 

Em: “But actually also I thought she was blonde, but also–“ 

Christine: Yeah. “I’ve never heard– What’s a wig? I mean, please, idiot. 

Em: [laughs] Yeah. 

Christine: Nice try, though. Nice try. It’s just pathetic. So he went to trial for murder on May 8, 2017, which was more than two years after he killed Chelsea. And of course, his defense was that Chelsea’s death was an accident. 

Em: Course. 

Christine: Uh, a terrible consequence of consensual sex and alcohol and unsafe sex. And of course, the evidence did not back this up because how did Ch– Remember where Chelsea’s costume was? Miles away from her body? 

Em: Mm-hmm. 

Christine: And he’s like, “Oh, I left her.” That’s– He doesn’t even remember. 

Em: She was just naked. That’s– She just– And he just left her. 

Christine: I– Yeah. Like what are you talking about? So he– He– It was like hidden in an abandoned building, her costume. 

Em: Right. 

Christine: And more than that, both s– apparently, both straps of her leotard had been cut open, and the fabric at h– at the crotch of the leotard had been cut open as well. 

Em: Ugh. [sighs] 

Christine: And so now we’re looking at rape rather than consensual sex to begin with. Let alone like all the other shit he added to the story, which like I hope she haunts– I hope he is haunted, not by her. I hope she has better things to do, but I hope he’s haunted for eternity with this shit. 

Em: I mean, the second that he said, “Oh, we had sex,” I knew exactly what that meant. 

Christine: And– Exactly. Like, come on. It’s the same old story every fucking time. 

Em: Especially– Wasn’t he also already in the– 

Christine: Wanted for violent rape? 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Of a different local girl, a local woman. 

Em: Yeah. You’re there for violent rape, and now you’re like, “We had sex, but I don’t remember her.” It’s like, “Oh, okay.” 

Christine: “But she wanted me to be violent.” 

Em: Right. 

Christine: Mm-hmm. 

Em: “But she actually died in– while having sex with me, but I’m here for violent rape but don’t think of that as violent rape.” 

Christine: “But that’s different.” Yeah. Uh, I– It just be– It boggles the mind really. Um– 

Em: Wow. 

Christine: So super sick. Super, super sick. Um, Chelsea’s remains also disputed Daniel’s alleged cause of death because the medical examiner (this is dark, guys) determined that Chelsea was actually beaten to death. Um– 

Em: Oh my god. 

Christine: Yeah. And not that, you know, anything would have been be– but just makes it even more violent, brutal– 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: –intentional. Um, her jaw was broken in half. 

Em: [gasps] 

Christine: I know. And her eye socket was fractured. Her– She had missing teeth, and she had endured some extreme violence at the end of her life. It was not an accidental strangulation. 

Em: Yeah. No, this was not accidental. 

Christine: Yeah. No, and he can’t even pretend. Um, although they tried, because Daniel’s defense team claimed that the skull fractures were post-mortem, um, injuries sustained when Daniel put logs on top of Chelsea’s remains, which is just a wild defense to take. But, um, they were like, “That’s not– That’s nothing.” 

Em: How do, how do they defend him, uh, at– for saying he didn’t actually know who she was, but he also was able to– 

Christine: Right. 

Em: He put fucking logs on a person? 

Christine: Yeah, yeah. 

Em: Didn’t remember her? 

Christine: I imagine, um, you’d say something like, “I plead the fifth,” you know. 

Em: Sure. Yeah. 

Christine: I don’t know. I don’t think you have anything. Or “she did it,” you know. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: It’s like I don’t even know what better defense he could have. Um, so on May 16, the jury deliberated for less than three hours, and then they declared Daniel Clay guilty of felony murder and concealing the death of an individual. In Michigan, the felony murder conviction carries a mandatory sentence of life in prison without the possibility of parole. Following Daniel’s sentencing, Chelsea’s mother released a letter about her daughter’s death. She referenced her publication, Choices, which she printed and distributed on cards alongside photos of Chelsea. Um, Choices is a short call to action to choose to do good in the world instead of commit harm and to respond when you see someone else committing harm. 

Em: Mm. 

Christine: She wrote, “We have become a nation that lives in fear. We turn away and choose to ignore things we don’t feel involve us. These are choices we need to change. We have to have the Light outshine the dark. People don’t need to endanger themselves. But if we see things that are not right or it looks questionable, please call 911. Yes, we will feel a bit foolish if we are wrong, but how are we going to feel if we were right and didn’t call?” 

Em: Mm. 

Christine: “You can’t change woulda, coulda, shoulda.” 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: [sighs] Gives me the shivers. So important note, you know, uh, as we end this story. Um, just so, so sad. Leannda said that Choices wasn’t just about Chelsea and her murder, but about everyone working together as a community. Like you were saying earlier, this guy’s trying to build community and somebody does the opposite, right? And like– 

Em: Immediately. 

Christine: –ruins the trust, the, the anything. Yeah. Um, and so– I will say it wasn’t immediate. You know why? Because he had been doing this party for years. This was just the first year that it went out of control. 

Em: Mm. 

Christine: Like this was the biggest one yet. And it’s like the wrong fucking people started showing up. And– 

Em: It’s moments like this where I realize why some people have like a cap on how many people can come to a party. 

Christine: Yeah, yeah. 

Em: ‘Cause you would think, “Oh, it’s a party. Anyone’s invited.” And it’s like, “Er, actually I really–“ 

Christine: Have you s– heard “Aaron’s Party,” the song, the hit song? 

Em: Actually, you’re totally right. I should have learned this a long time ago. 

Christine: The hit single? [laughs] 

Em: I literally– 

Christine: “What about your mother’s vase?” [laughs] 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: “What are you gonna do about that? [whisper shouts] Aaron!” 

Em: You’re totally right. I, um, I totally ignored the lesson there. 

Christine: That was the moral of that story. Um, and– 

Em: I know. 

Christine: –also like I want to be invited to a cool party at Aaron Carter’s house. That was my other lesson. 

Em: [laughs] 

Christine: Um, anyway, okay. So that– that’s, uh, the story. Um, Leannda also said that Choices wasn’t about Chelsea, but everyone working together as a community, like I said, to intervene in and stand up against acts of violence, especially– I– fucking assholes like this who keep doing it. And– 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Ugh [sighs], god. 

Em: I know. 

Christine: Yeah, but he looked like such a fucking– Like in that interview interrogation, he’s sitting there like being all smug and saying gross stuff about how she wanted it a certain way– I mean, it’s just fucking gross. Like– 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: –go to jail– go to prison, you piece of shit. 

Em: Like, “I only, I only pay attention to hot girls.” 

Christine: Ugh! 

Em: “Oh, wait. She was a hot girl because I had sex with her.” 

Christine: Oh, right. Yeah, that’s right. 

Em: “And also she wanted me to hurt her, so it’s not my fault.” 

Christine: Uh-huh. 

Em: “But also I didn’t hurt her, so I don’t know what happened. But also I don’t remember her. I did put logs on her. I don’t remember her, though.” 

Christine: Yeah, but also, uh– 

Em: Every step of the way was just– 

Christine: “I’m sure I won’t–“ 

Em: I don’t mean to be so repetitive about it. I’m just like so flabbergasted at the like– 

Christine: It’s flabberga– It’s, it’s shocking. 

Em: You’re totally, you’re totally right. ’Cause earlier I was like, “Oh, how did he react when he got found out and all that?” And– 

Christine: He just seems to be– 

Em: Total– 

Christine: –like nonplussed. Like just like– 

Em: Great word. 

Christine: [chuckles] I don’t know if I’ve ever said that out loud. [laughs] It just popped into my head. 

Em: No, but it’s exactly right. It’s like he just– It’s like not even– 

Christine: He’s like barely phased by it. Like, come on. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: That’s– I feel like that’s a trait of like ps– being a psychopath, like a violent psychopath. I feel like there’s that trait of– ’Cause I remember, uh, reading– I go through phases where I like read books about, um, psychopathy and stuff, which you know ’cause in grad school I did that story– or that, that– What was it? Never mind. Maybe you don’t even remember. 

Em: A TV pitch? 

Christine: No, it was a– Yeah, it was in Paul– What was his name? Paul Schaefer? Is that his name or something? 

Em: It, it– I wanna say Schiefer. 

Christine: You didn’t like him. 

Em: No, I hated him. 

Christine: Yeah, I liked him. But he– Uh, he gave me an A on that presentation. Maybe that’s why I liked him. But I’ve like– 

Em: He gave me a lot of non-As, which is why I didn’t like him. [laughs] 

Christine: [laughs] Um, but I remember like reading a book, and they said something like, “You won’t– You can’t understand that brain of like a violent psychopath.” Like they– Especially in a scenario like this, like they don’t get freaked out or like scared. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: It’s like they’re just like, “Whatever,” you know? I don’t know. It’s just creepy. 

Em: Just totally apathetic to it or whatever. 

Christine: Yeah. And it’s like of course, there’s the fear of getting caught. Like they don’t want to get caught, but it’s like there’s just a lack of like real like deep down– I don’t know– 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: –guilt or terror or like feelings. I don’t know. It’s just creepy. But yeah, he’s just a fucking douche. 

Em: [chuckles] Yeah. 

Christine: He’s just a gross man. [chuckles] A really just gross man. Um, so anyway, sorry to ruin everyone’s day. Thank you for listening, and happy November. We’re getting close to a certain song. 

Em: Oh, we are. 

Christine: [laughs] 

Em: Oh man. 

Christine: This is the first year I’ll remember actually making– 

Em: I was gonna say– I was like, “Do you know what you’re about to say?” 

Christine: I don’t either, yeah. 

Em: “Because I’m, I’m ready to break into song whenever you’re ready.” 

Christine: I was as shocked as you were when I said it. 

Em: Okay. Cool. 

Christine: [laughs] [sighs] 

Em: Oy-yoy-yoy. Well, yeah. Thank you, everybody. If you, um, want more of this, go on Patreon and give us a listen over there. We’ve got other content, including today’s secret surprise, um, that I broke to Christine, um, during our intermission. And– 

Christine: Yeah, it’s really disturbing. And I think you can also, if you’re listening, um, on certain platforms, you can click the episode, and it’ll bring you to our Patreon, I think. 

Em: Yeah. 

Christine: Or maybe a bonus– or a plus thing– subscription or– I don’t know, something like that. 

Em: Yeah, I think uh– I think they go chronologically, including Patreon content. 

Christine: Yeah, yeah, which is kind of fun. 

Em: Um, anyway, yeah, thanks for listening. We’ll see you when it’s o-officially November instead of, you know, just post-October. You know what I’m saying? 

Christine: Yes. Very true, very true. Um, we’ll see you then. 

Em: And– 

Christine: That’s– 

Em: Why– 

Christine: We– 

Em: Drink. 

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